Kwiggles' Joe has passed

[Kwiggles]

Thank you, thank you Natalie for making room for us on this site!

I just started my dog Joe on Lysodren loading yesterday and came online looking for a little moral support and eeek! - no caninecushings.com.

So far Joe is doing fine, no adverse reactions to the drug, still eating, drinking & peeing & me looking on nervously, waiting for 'the sign' of when to stop.

Such a relief to know I have a place to come where people understand...

Thanks again & fingers crossed that the website is soon up & running again.

Karen & Joe

[ventilate]

Re: Kwiggles

Karen;
glad you'er here. Good luck with the loading, just be sure you watch closely. you want to watch for anything that makes you go "hummm" makes you think thats odd or Humm I wonder if that means anything. It usually does. you know your dog best and if you notice anything out of the ordinary ( whatever that means for a cush dog) stop the lysodren and get a stim. it may be just not snapping for a cookie but taking it gently, or stopping while eating and looking around instead of being head down butt up till its gone.
How much does your dog weigh and how much lysodren are you giving? what tests were done to confirm Cushings?
Sharon

[gpgscott]

Re: Kwiggles' Joe is starting lysodren

Hi Karen, and welcome to you and Joe.

Please let us comment on the dosing, would you post Joe's wt. the dose, and would you tell us what symptoms and tests led to the diagnosis.

Best to you both. Scott

[Squirt's Mom]

Re: Kwiggles' Joe is starting lysodren

Hi Karen,

So good to see that you and Joe found us here! Since we don't have all our info from cc.net, could you fill us in on the pariculars again....weight, dose, schedule, etc?

Hang in there and you will do just fine. Just remember if you see anything that makes you go "hummmmm", he may be loaded. Something as simple as looking up from his bowl for a second where before he would gulp it all down.

We are here so don't hesitate to ask any questions, especially if you have doubts.

Hugs,
Leslie and the girls

[LuvMyMunchie]

Re: Kwiggles' Joe is starting lysodren

Hi Karen,

Haven't got anything to add but I do have a question.....is this Joe Cocker????

If it is, glad you found us and good luck with the Lysodren loading. If not, the same applies!

Louise

[mytil]

Re: Kwiggles' Joe is starting lysodren

Hi Karen,

Sure am glad you found us here - as Scott mentioned, please give the amount of Lysodren you are giving and the weight of your pup?

Were you able to download from the other site Lysodren loading instructions?

The signs can be subtle, such a slight pause when eating, like taking a second to look up at you. Anything that may make you go hhmmmm.

Also, watch out for diarrhea, vomiting and lethargy. Did your vet give you any prednisone just in case the cortisol levels fall too low.

Please keep us posted as you go through this and if you have any questions, please ask.
Terry

[Lulusmom]

Re: Kwiggles' Joe is starting lysodren

In case you haven't noticed yet, acushdogsmom has posted a sticky entitled "Lysodren Loading Instructions and related tips". I highly recommend that you print a copy and keep it handy while loading Joe. I've loaded about, now let me see, I think five times and you should see my copy of that handy reference material. You wouldn't want to touch it without gloves.

Glynda

[mytil]

Re: Kwiggles' Joe is starting lysodren

Yes, as Glynda mentioned, we now have this attachment available so print it out.

Continue to keep us posted
Terry

[Kwiggles]

Re: Kwiggles' Joe is starting lysodren

Hello again all!

Yes, this is Joe Cocker I'm talking about- I had a very lengthy (only slightly shorter than War & Peace) post on the Cushings website with all the details of his diagnosis and treatment plan. Let's see if I can summarize it:

Joe has been showing Cushings symptoms for several months, starting with frequent urination (large volumes), excessive water drinking & hair thinning/loss.

On 12/30/08 he had ACTH stimulation test, results were:
pre 8.4 ug/dL
post 34.9 ug/dL

To diifferentiate PDH from adrenal, on 1/06/09 he had high dose Dexamethasone test, results were:

pre 8.7 ug/dL
4 hr post 4.4 ug/dL
8 hr post 6.8 ug/dL

This was a bit borderline so my vet suspected possible adrenal tumor. He did chest & abdominal x-ray and saw no neoplasia so we proceeded to endogenous ACTH test on 2/16/09. Results were: 48.5 pg/mL

I took Joe to Cornell Animal Hospital on 3/27/09 for abdominal ultrasound with hopes to get a good look at his adrenals. The ultrasonographer was able to visualize clearly the left adrenal and said it was 'slightly enlarged' but no tumor present. The right adrenal was obscured by a loop of bowel so could not be measured or fully visualized but the portion she could see 'appeared to be mineralized', suggesting a tumor.

My vet and I decided to proceed with Lysodren therapy to give Joe some relief from his symptoms with plans to continue in future to attempt to visualize the adrenals, by re-check ultrasound or maybe CAT scan or MRI.

For the Lysodren loading: Joe is 30 lbs and my vet had me give him 500 mg per day (divided into 2 doses per day: 250 AM and 250 PM), starting on Sunday 4/12. I think this dose is slightly on the low side of the range. (?)

For the 2 days prior to starting loading, I measured his water intake and it was 3000 mL on Friday and 2900 mL Saturday. Since starting loading, he drank 3200 mL on Sunday and 2600 yesterday (Monday).

His appetite has remained voracious, he just Hoovers up his meal without hesitation.

So far, so good- he seems to be feeling okay and tolerating the treatment well and I am keeping an eagle eye on him so I won't miss 'the sign'.

If I've left out anything, just ask and I'll see if I can find it (My 'Joe' folder is bulging with paperwork...).

Thanks again everybody for your good wishes and support.

Karen & Joe

[Wylie's Mom]

Re: Kwiggles' Joe is starting lysodren

Hi Karen,

You are doing a great job! It looks like the dose is 36.67 mg/kg/day. If there are no other signs beforehand and if my calculations are correct, according to the Lysodren instructions, you should stop the Lysodren if Joe's water consumption gets to 818mL per day (60 ml/kg/day). You might want to stop before it gets that low because Lysodren continues to work for about 48 hours after dosing and I don't know if they took that into consideration. Others may have a different opinion on this. You may get some other sign before this happens anyway.

Since it is a low dose, did you & your vet have a preset time to stop and test if no signs are seen?

Also, did your vet give you some prednisone (for the dog, not you) in case of overloading? Might not have to use it, but it's better to be prepared just in case.

Best of luck to you!

-Susy

[Kwiggles]

Re: Kwiggles' Joe is starting lysodren

Hi Susy,

My vet and I arranged that he will call me on Friday (day 6 of loading) if I don't call him before that to tell him Joe has shown signs of loading being complete. We'll talk then about how to proceed. He's been great about making himself available to talk to during this process.

Forgot to say last time- thanks to whomever (Scott, maybe?) moved my post and started a new thread for me- much easier this way.

And thanks, yes, i do have a printed copy of the loading instructions (by some miracle I was inspired to print it out last Friday right before the Cushings site went away- phew) Also have some very thorough guidelines from my vet and have the Pred standing by in case Joe needs it, so I guess we are good to go.
I'll be sure to relate to Joe all the good vibes coming his way- thanks folks, I'll keep you posted.

Karen & Joe

[LuvMyMunchie]

Re: Kwiggles' Joe is starting lysodren

Hi Karen,

Just thought I'd drop in and see how Joe (and you) are doing. Sounds like you've got everything well covered with the Lysodren loading info, the pred on hand and a communication line open with your vet.

Glad Joe is feeling well and look forward to your updates on his progress.

Louise

P.S. Is Joe still going to do his rendition of the other Cocker's "Feeling Alright" when loading is completed???

Louise

[Kwiggles]

Re: Kwiggles' Joe is starting lysodren

Hello again all, just checking in:

We are now on Day 4 of loading and everything seems to be proceeding well. No change in Joe's appetite or eating habits so far (still voracious) but looks like he is just starting to back off on the water consumption a little- down from 3000 ml to around 2400 per day. Is it supposed to gradually taper off like this or is the decrease generally more dramatic?

Last night, I was going through some notes I had written down from my online research and came across the following quote (regarding Lysodren treatment):

"90% of dogs with pituitary Cushings load on days 5,6,7 or 8."

Don't know where I got that from, but can anyone comment on that? When I asked my vet when can I expect to see that Joe is loaded, he talked about how every dog is unique, etc, but that he has never had a dog load by day 3 and rarely before day 5. And with Joe there's the complicating factor that we're still not sure whether his problem is pituitary or adrenal.

Tomorrow is day 5 so I will plan to be especially attentive. (*sigh*, I will be so glad when this is done and we can relax a little....)

And yes Louise, Joe and I will be doing the happy doggie dance to the tune of 'Feelin Alright' (and breathing a big sigh of relief) when loading is complete

[ventilate]

Re: Kwiggles' Joe is starting lysodren

My dog loaded in 4 days and I know of many that have loaded that fast or even faster. It seems that large dogs load faster, Nike was about 90 lbs when we started. Your vet is correct all dogs are different and there is no way to know how long it will take, some take a very long time. I think Kim did a reload that took close to a month or it seems like it did, I know it was very long and she holds the reloading record.
It seems that most dogs do load around 5 days, my vet had me start on thurs as he did not work mondays and said that Nike should load when he was working, well it didnt quite work that way. So I would really start to watch close, It is probably close. Nike left a few kibble for her boyfriend and did not wake me up the night before to go out to pee, she had not done either in a very long time, so I knew that was the sign I as waiting for. I was told to give 1/2 the food and if they ate it all as they had before, give the meds, so i gave her the meds then she left the few kibble and she should not have had that dose and had I of waited till she was done her meal I would not have given the meds to her so be sure you are giving the meds AFTER you watch Kwiggle eat the entire meal then give the meds followed by a bit more food or treat to be sure the med moves down into the stomach. If in doubt dont give the meds remember once it is given you cant take it back, and your gut is usually right.
Good luck and keep watching and you will see
Sharon, Nike and Kenai

[Squirt's Mom]

Re: Kwiggles' Joe is starting lysodren

Hi Karen,

You are doing a great job watching Joe and I'm sure you will notice that "hmmmm" moment.

Hugs,
Leslie and the girls