I am new:) 12 yr old peke-a-poo

[crystal]

Hi I am new to this forum and would like to introduce myslef. My nsame is Crystal. I am the proud owner of Snickers, my 12 yr old pek-a-poo. During a recent visit to the vet for pre-surgery blood work for some dental work the vet came back out to the waiting area and called me back in. She said my dogs blood sugar was 553 and was way out of normal range. She said she belived the may be something with her pancreas so she did and ultrasound and found a small mass which she beleived had part in the sugar issue. They kept her for 3 days, put her on Hills prescription diet w/d and 6 units of insulin once a day. They still have not been able to regulate it and I have to go back for a curve in 2 weeks. Snickers showed no signs of any problems other that 2 accidents she had in the house wich was totally unlike her. I have always been told to never buy dog food with corn as the first ingredient and have always feed iams in the past. Is there other dog food out there or should I stick with what my vet has perscribed(I would not change without consulting my vet first). So I would love to know how many people have had dogs with this for a long time. Is it hard to regulate? Any tips would be great. I gave my first shot this morning and did well. I just dont know what I am up against and what to expect. Thanks for listening

[eyelostit]

Re: I am new 12 yr old peke-a-poo

Hi I am new to this forum and would like to introduce myslef. My nsame is Crystal. I am the proud owner of Snickers, my 12 yr old pek-a-poo. During a recent visit to the vet for pre-surgery blood work for some dental work the vet came back out to the waiting area and called me back in. She said my dogs blood sugar was 553 and was way out of normal range. She said she belived the may be something with her pancreas so she did and ultrasound and found a small mass which she beleived had part in the sugar issue. They kept her for 3 days, put her on Hills prescription diet w/d and 6 units of insulin once a day. They still have not been able to regulate it and I have to go back for a curve in 2 weeks. Snickers showed no signs of any problems other that 2 accidents she had in the house wich was totally unlike her. I have always been told to never buy dog food with corn as the first ingredient and have always feed iams in the past. Is there other dog food out there or should I stick with what my vet has perscribed(I would not change without consulting my vet first). So I would love to know how many people have had dogs with this for a long time. Is it hard to regulate? Any tips would be great. I gave my first shot this morning and did well. I just dont know what I am up against and what to expect. Thanks for listening

Hi Crystal and Snickers !! Welcome

Sorry you got the dx of diabetes but we'll all help you out with that.

When was she diagnoised, and how much does she weigh?

Is the Insulin Vetsulin/Caninsulin?

Most dogs are put on the Hills WD dry or canned or Purina DCO when first dx.

Some of us use other foods, right now I'd stick with what food you are using to see how this works with the insulin

Has your vet mentioned 2 injections a day with the insulin, or are they waiting until after the curve ?

Most dogs need 2 injections per day, 12 hrs apart, I think I have only seeen a handful over the years that did well on 1 injection daily.

Congrats on giving the injections !! I know at first all this seems hard but everything will fall into place. My dog Niki has been diabetic for over 6 yrs now, I'm sure you will get the hang of this and we are here to help you

Ask any questions even if you think they are dumb, cuz we already asked them.

We have alot of info pages at the top of the forum.

Again Welcome
Dolly

[BestBuddy]

Re: I am new 12 yr old peke-a-poo

Hi Crystal,

Welcome to you and Snickers. It looks like you caught the diabetes early (only a couple of accidents) which is a really good thing, a lot of us have a dog in crisis when we get the diagnosis.

Congratulation on the first injection, it does get easier. My diabetic Buddy passed away early this year at age 15 1/2 after having diabetes for over 6 1/2 years.

I noticed Snickers is only on one injection and you will probably find that she needs two a day 12 hours apart with food. Most dogs (if not all) do not regulate on only one injection a day.

As for the food, what brand? If Snickers is eating it I don't think I would be making any changes with that at the moment.

[crystal]

Re: I am new 12 yr old peke-a-poo

Thanks Dolly and Bestbuddy it is nice find someone who is going thru the same thing. So many "stupid" people (family & freinds) have made the comment "why dont you put her down, thats awefull, she is 12".....blah,blah, blah and I think the next person who says it may get a peice of my mind. I feel like I am a bit alone, other than a freind who totally agrees with everything so it was so nice to find this forum. Snickers is only on one shot a day, I am going to mention to the vet about the two doses. I think they were just giving it two weeks to see what happened with the food change and a low dose> It is vetsulin that she is on and she gets 6 units with her first meal of the day. She gets1/2 cup of dry food and 1/4 wet twice a day and it sounds like I should stick to the Hills brand for now. She weighed 10.2 when I brought her the other day .She seems a little quieter than usual since the insulin started, do you guys test at home? Her curve is scheduled in 2 weeks I hope things are lower. I will def. keep you guys psoted as things change and for sure look for some good advicethanks again, crystal

[We Hope]

Re: I am new 12 yr old peke-a-poo

Welcome Crystal!

My Lucky was about 14 when he was diagnosed with diabetes. He ate the W/D wet but was always on two shots of Caninsulin/Vetsulin a day.

I knew people who had tried regulating their dogs on one shot per day; before Vetsulin was approved in the US, that was the only dosing pattern information given. All of those who tried regulating their dogs on one shot a day got nowhere until they switched to two shots.

When we started using Caninsulin/Vetsulin, that was still the only dosing pattern Intervet recommended. Lucky had always used two shots a day of any insulin; he originally regulated on the old Lily Iletin II Lente, which was a U 100 strength version of Caninsulin/Vetsulin. When we started him with the Caninsulin/Vetsulin, it was with two shots a day.

We were pleased with what the W/D did for his bg's. He started the W/D about a week before we changed him to the old Lilly insulin; the insulin we were using at the time was being given at resistance dose but wasn't doing anything for bg control. The first indication we got that Lucky's bg's could come down was after he started eating W/D; we knew it wasn't the insulin bringing them down because it had done nothing up to that point.

With the combination of wet W/D and Caninsulin/Vetsulin twice a day, Lucky went from having bg's in the 500-600 and up range to having an 85 about 8-10 hours after his breakfast and morning insulin. He went from being his doctor's most complicated diabetes patient ever to being his easiest to control and most stable.

If the W/D is working for you, I'd say to stay with it.

Kathy

[eyelostit]

Re: I am new 12 yr old peke-a-poo

Hi Crystal,

I know how you feel about the friends telling you what you should do. I went thru the same thing with Niki and my other dog, some people like to have a dog to just have a dog if you know what I mean. When Niki was first dx I was out of my mind, I cried, we went on our journey alone with this for 9 mo. before I could find a help board to help us, so I am glad you found us.

You're not alone anymore
Dolly

[janspack]

Re: I am new 12 yr old peke-a-poo

Hi Crystal,

Welcome to this forum. I'm fairly new (almost 4 months since my dog was dx) so may not be able to help much with the practical side of things. I can certainly help with support though if you need it.

Don't know what I would have done without this forum because Dazzle has lots of problems all due to chronic pancreatitis and has been very difficult to get stable.

Hope you soon get Snickers on an even keel.

[peggy0]

Re: I am new 12 yr old peke-a-poo

Welcome Crystal and Snickers!! my dog was diagnosed 6 months ago. This board is my peace of mind and you'll get a few laughs along the way learning about what our furry friends do to make us smile everyday. My advise would be to get a monitor so you can watch her yourself. I felt much better about knowing where Forbys BG level was. There are posts about what monitors are available. Lots of good advise here on food, insulin and other tricks to help you along the way, and friendly encouragement as you're going through this with all of us.

[Jooniper]

Re: I am new 12 yr old peke-a-poo

Hi Crystal! Welcome! This forum is wonderful and the people here are so helpful and supportive! I'm glad you found it!

I'm new too Virgil was diagnosed about a month ago. He started peeing in the house (like Snickers, very unlike him) and we took him to the vet to get about the same bg readings as you have We started the same way; 1 shot a day of 6 units in the morning. We have changed to 2 times a day and are slowly increasing his dosing.

Hang in there! The testing, monitoring and shots just sorta become routine.

Virgil was/ is lethargic at times too, just kinda down. We are thinking that its the high blood glucose that's doing it. Virgil is still high, and unregulated. I put this, because when I first started out giving the insulin, before I got my bg meter I thought he could be going hypo and it scared me enough to give him Karo, which I'm sure made it worse. So don't panic, ask questions

The support thing is hard. You wont find better support than here, tho I wish you had some at home too. You both deserve that

Glad your here!

Jennifer

[crystal]

Re: I am new 12 yr old peke-a-poo

Thanks everyone!! Snickers seems to be doing well,we took her camping this weekend which was a little more work than ususal trying to make sure she didnt get any of kids leftovers. She has awlays loved kids due to the fact that they ddrop stuff on the floor She is still having her down times, but seems to be getting better. It is always after I give her the insulin. Well I hope every one has a Happy Memorial Day!!!

[k9diabetes]

Re: I am new 12 yr old peke-a-poo

Hi Crystal,

Since Snickers is still on only one injection of insulin a day and it's a fairly large one for her size - 6 units for 10 pounds of dog... I worry that the dose is too high and her blood sugar is going low in that first hour or two after her injection.

Would you be able to take her in to the vet for a BG check at about the time she's seems to be lethargic?

I assume they chose this dose while she was hospitalized but she could need less insulin now after having blood sugar in a better range for a while.

I'd feel better if they checked her out to make sure she isn't getting too much insulin now.

Are you monitoring her blood sugar in any way?

Have you considered home testing her blood sugar?

Natalie

[crystal]

Snickers update!! I need help please

Okay so this has been crazy so far and sometimes I feel like my vet is just to busy for my questions. Snickers is 10# and was originally given a dose of 6 units of Vetsulin with the am feeding. She went back for her curve a week later and after 4-6 hours she was so low they had to offer her food (80 range). So they lowered her dose to 5 units and I did this for a week and she still seemed to be acting kinda weak around the 4-6 hour range so I called and suggested she be switched to twice a day and I told them that I was worried of her being to low when I am at work. So they kinda gave me the run around and said yes, 3 units twice a day. I got a home testing kit and started testing her on my own and last night she was so low 3- 4 hours after her feeding and dose it was reading 75, 62, 50, then it just kept saying low. I gave her food again and she was up to 108 by midnight. I tested her this morning before food and she was 258, gave her the food and I got nervous and only gave her 2 units as I was going to work and was afraid she would go to low. I tested her again at 7 pm before her feeding and she was 307 so I gave her the 2 units again and plan to test her tonight until bed. She hates me testing her. I am testing her at the base of the tail as she was biting me when I was trying her pad of her paws. I am getting so frustrated. She is eating 1/2 can wet w/d twice a day. Can someone tell me what I might be doing wrong. I am spending so much money and seem to be going in circles. I dont think my vet has delt a whole lot with this, from what I have read her dose should have been decreased by 20% when she was changes to twice a day instead of increased? thanks for your help

[We Hope]

Re: I am new 12 yr old peke-a-poo

OK, we'll try to take this a bit at a time.

We always used the insulin according to X amount of IU per kilo (2.2 lb) of body weight per dose. When Lucky was switched to Caninsulin/Vetsulin, the initial dose was based on his current insulin dose and that was all done according to the above. So let's look at what a starting dose for Snickers might be.

10 lb=4.54 kg, which we will round down to 4.5 kg for the example.
0.5 IU X 4.5=2.25 IU of insulin.

So you are closer to the right starting dose with the 2 units twice a day.

What happens when you hit lows is that this will trigger the body's counter-regulatory hormones who automatically send the bg's up in an effort to protect it from what it sees as harm.

When you do have a low trigger these hormones which send the bg's up, the higher bg's can be around for at least 2-3 days from it. The answer here isn't to increase the insulin right now to respond to these highs but to be consistent with the number of units you're giving now to let the body settle down a bit.

We had a situation where we got weak insulin from Lilly (before Vetsulin was US approved). At the time, you couldn't just go to a pharmacy and buy a new vial because they didn't stock it--they had to order it for you.

The brand new vials were so weak, we had no choice but to go back to the old vial of insulin, which was supposed to be replaced by the new (weak) ones. Since we knew that the old vial wasn't 100% potent anymore, but we didn't know exactly how much potency it had left, we could not risk increasing the insulin dose--had to leave it just as it was. It took about 2-3 days to bring Lucky's bg's down with the old vial. Even though we had to work with less than "perfect" insulin, we were able to get them down by being consistent with food and insulin--same every 12 hours.

It looks like 3 units twice a day is too much insulin for Snickers, based on what you had in bg readings. 2 units twice a day may not be enough--you'll need to see how her bg's are doing on that once things settle down from hitting the low.

When you see "LO" on a meter (any except GlucoPet/GlucoVet), it means that the blood glucose is less than 20 mg/dl. It sounds like you were fortunate that Snickers didn't have a hypo.

Try staying with the 2 units twice a day for a bit unless you start seeing some bg's like you did with Snickers on the 3 units twice a day. After things get straightened out from hitting the low and the bg's going up because of it, you might find that she needs something more like 2.5 units twice a day.

HTH!

Kathy

[eyelostit]

Re: I am new 12 yr old peke-a-poo

Sounds like you're on the right track, in a few days you'll get a better picture of how the 2 units is working, glad you are doing 2 injections per day now.

Hang in there
Dolly

[Margaret Boyle]

Re: Snickers update!! I need help please

Okay so this has been crazy so far and sometimes I feel like my vet is just to busy for my questions. Snickers is 10# and was originally given a dose of 6 units of Vetsulin with the am feeding. She went back for her curve a week later and after 4-6 hours she was so low they had to offer her food (80 range). So they lowered her dose to 5 units and I did this for a week and she still seemed to be acting kinda weak around the 4-6 hour range so I called and suggested she be switched to twice a day and I told them that I was worried of her being to low when I am at work. So they kinda gave me the run around and said yes, 3 units twice a day. I got a home testing kit and started testing her on my own and last night she was so low 3- 4 hours after her feeding and dose it was reading 75, 62, 50, then it just kept saying low. I gave her food again and she was up to 108 by midnight. I tested her this morning before food and she was 258, gave her the food and I got nervous and only gave her 2 units as I was going to work and was afraid she would go to low. I tested her again at 7 pm before her feeding and she was 307 so I gave her the 2 units again and plan to test her tonight until bed. She hates me testing her. I am testing her at the base of the tail as she was biting me when I was trying her pad of her paws. I am getting so frustrated. She is eating 1/2 can wet w/d twice a day. Can someone tell me what I might be doing wrong. I am spending so much money and seem to be going in circles. I dont think my vet has delt a whole lot with this, from what I have read her dose should have been decreased by 20% when she was changes to twice a day instead of increased? thanks for your help

Hi Crystal,
Just to say welcome you will get plenty of support here. Some things I can help with and others I can't.
All I can say is start doing home testing if you can it gives you a better hang on things.
Lucy started on once a day on Caninsulin and it done nothing for her but we think we are getting somewhere now they changed her insulin she was on Insuvet Lente to begin with but started on Caninsulin in Feb after 16months.

You will do just fine a lot of up's and down's along the way but you will get there.