Ace - Maltese diagnosed 11/2014

[kevbo887]

Hello, first id like to introduce myself, im new here and very concerned. My 6 year old maltese, Ace, has been acting strange the past month. Drinking a lot of water, and peeing nonstop, even in the house, which he rarely ever does. We thought maybe a uti so we took him to the vet yesterday and they did a urinalysis. No results yet on the culture, but they did say he had glucose in his urine, but no ketones. Vet says its definitely diabetes and we should get a blood test on tuesday to confirm it.

Im very very concerned for my best buddy, so I checked his blood glucose today with my one touch. It was 204. Not sure if thats high for a dog, but he is now on an antibiotic in case it is a uti (taken 3 pills so far) so not sure if that has anything to do in raising his blood sugar.

Other than the drinking of water and urinating, he shows no other signs or symptoms of diabetes. I will admit, he eats way to many dog treats (what can I say, hes a good boy!) and occasionally chicken or steak pieces if we have it for dinner.

Now heres my main question, what are the chances hes not actually diabetic, and the higher glucose levels are from the uti? Also, if it is diabetes, would that number of 204, require insulin, or just no more cookies for my boy and a diet change?

Thank you all so much, like I said im very nervous, and Tuesday cant come soon enough, my poor buddy.

[kevbo887]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

Should note the antibiotic he is on is clavamox 125mg twice a day.

I took his blood glucose an hour after his dinner and meal. Was 227.

Question is, could a uti and medicine raise his blood glucose to this level?

Also, he has some anxiety issues, and pretty jealous of my 7 month old daughter.

Thanks all, im just so worried about my boy.

[amydunn19]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

Hi and welcome to our forum! You might not get many responses as weekends are kind of slow around here but some others will be around to say hello.

Chances are not great that your vet was wrong about the diabetes diagnosis. Dogs typically are type 1 diabetics, unlike cats, so diet probably didn't cause it and certainly won't fix it. A normal functioning pancreas normally wouldn't allow a UTI to raise the body's blood glucose. So, I would imagine his pancreas has some type of damage at this point. Some unspayed females get a type of diabetes that can be "cured" by having them spayed but not always. The good news is his blood sugar isn't terribly high but you don't have much to go on except a couple of tests so you don't know how high he is going yet.

The other bit of good news is that diabetes is totally doable - it does require some structure to your schedule. Dogs can live normal lives with diabetes - my dog has been diagnosed 7 years now. Once you get your dog on a feeding schedule and insulin, they start feeling better and life goes on as before. They are susceptible to UTI's and pancreatitis so it is essential to keep a handle on their blood sugar and not to feed them really fatty snacks and food. We can help and this forum has lots of great information about diabetes. I would say just read some of the stories and information. Knowledge is power so learn as much as you can now and you will be ahead.

[Grayson]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

Test him again about four or more hours from his meal, when he's had some time to digest and convert it to drive up his blood glucose level...that'll show you just how high its likely going. The one touch is the closest human meter to the animal designed Alphatrak, but the results you're getting will be lower than his actual BG is with the vets meter. Many here use the one touch or Relion brand as cheaper ways to spot check and monitor levels, then some do a curve with an Alphatrak so they don't need to convert results to find the true BG. Infections of any type can mess with the numbers, as can the medications used to treat them - either up or down, you can't be sure of the real numbers until its cleared up or ruled out.

As for the treats, we can all understand giving in to those eyes! You being liberal with treats did not cause him to become diabetic. It is a disease of the endocrine system that happens to even the most fit and well fed dogs. You are NOT to blame, so don't feel like its your fault! Giving steak or chicken is not a bad treat option as proteins are less likely to raise numbers than biscuits or any regular doggie chew. If he will eat veggies, you can use green beans or broccoli to treat him - we give straight from the freezer as he likes the crunch.

Try to keep calm and wait for your vet check on Tuesday. If there are no ketones, he should be fine to go for a few more days before you begin treatment. Take some time here to read and inform yourself on what you can do to get on the path to regulated BG levels. If you've got questions, there is always someone here on the forum that will be ready to help you out.

[jesse girl]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

yes the 204 is not very high and may point to your pup is still producing some insulin . if he wasnt blood sugar would be much higher . my jesse was diagnosed with blood sugar in the 600s

you do need more testing and not just one test at the vets to determine a diagnosis . in this situation i may do multiple tests throughout the day (curve ) before jumping into a dose of insulin . if these numbers remained in the 200s and lower the normal starting dose might need to be allot lower or not give any at all . some dogs on the forum can only get blood sugar in the 200s and higher with injected insulin

there could be some pancreatic problems going on affecting how insulin is produces and something to look into

glad your testing it will help to figure this out

[kevbo887]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

Thank you all for your kind responses I really appreciate it.

This was just an overwhelming thing to go on with my current life (becoming a father, suffering a brain injury that has caused permanent damage, being out of work) its been a long year needless to say.

Luckily he loves carrots and blueberries, so that can hopefully help maintain some treat rewards for him. I have some chicken dethawing that I will cook and cut up as an occassional reward, and part of his meals. Decided Ill be doing a lot of home cooking for his food after doing some internet research.

I look forward to reading through this forum for some helpful information!

Also, as an update, I took his blood sugar again and it was 201. Also one thing to notice is after being on the meds for a little bit, his drinking and urinating was back to normal today. (one and a half bowls of water, and 4 urinations) Lately he was going to urinate 10+ times a day, and drinking multiple bowls of water. Not sure what it means, but Tuesday still cant come soon enough.

Once again, thank you all who have responded thus far, it has helped to settle me down quite a bit.

[Charlie's mom]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

Welcome to you and Ace!

Deep breaths, this is totally doable! EveryOne on this forum was once a newbie, and we all understand the range of emotions you are experiencing now. If you're already testing you'll be very comfortable with the injections in a surprisingly short time.

As you may have read in all of our threads most of us purchase our insulin at Walmart, as well as our syringes. Many vets prescribe Humulin which can be over $80 a bottle, Walmart's Humulin N is less than $25.

Laura

[Grayson]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

I'm not sure about the blueberries, but I do know that carrots are actually high in natural sugars. Grayson used to get carrots every day before his diagnosis, but now he only gets the lower carb veggies - green beans, broccoli, cauliflower and some peas - all straight from the freezer. If Ace likes cheese, you might try a tiny bit of low fat mozzarella, etc. My boy has radar for the sound of the zip close on the bag of shredded cheese. He still gets a pinch of it a couple times in a week, so he isn't totally deprived...

[kevbo887]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

Realized I made a mistake on my last post. It was 291, not 201.
Took it first thing this morning and it was 160.

Thanks again all. Going to try some homemade cooking for him today!

[farrwf]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

Good morning and welcome to the best place on the planet for K9 diabetes information, advice and fellowship.

Ace's B/G numbers aren't real high, so running the course with the antibiotics, then evaluating seems to make sense. From what you've stated, I'm guessing he is diabetic. The antibiotic is likely having some impact on his numbers, as well.

[jesse girl]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

you may have caught it early which is kind of rare so i think a home cooked low glycemic diet may work for a period . it can all end tomorrow or go on for years

most dogs are treated as type one diabetic where there body doesnt really produce any insulin

we have seen some dogs only needing one shot a day for life showing they are maybe a type 2 and the body needing a bit of help keeping blood sugar adequate

there is no medication for type 2 diabetic dogs as you see in humans and really no information on it . it could be temporary as with some pancreatic problems or some other medical issues . we see in unspayed females with gestational diabetes flowing in and out of being diabetic when they go in and out of heat .

your testing so you will be able to know. a full blood panel maybe appropriate and placing emphasis on the pancreas . some dogs have miner symptoms from pancreatitis and a inflamed pancreas can have an affect

i believe my jesse became diabetic from pancreatitis

[CraigM]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

Realized I made a mistake on my last post. It was 291, not 201.
Took it first thing this morning and it was 160.

Thanks again all. Going to try some homemade cooking for him today!

I'm probably going to receive some good natured disagreement with this, but I wonder if home cooking is really better than feeding a good quality dog food? I'm sure there are certain reasons that some may do better with home cooking, but my (limited) experience just wasn't worth it.

My biggest problem was making each meal EXACTLY the same as the next. Did I use the same cut of meat, with the same amount of fat content? If the recipe called for potatoes, did each portion have the exact same amount? Same concern for the other ingredients; was each meal identical? Now, to keep Annie's meals as close to the same as possible, I weigh her kibble with a food scale.

We home cooked for a few months early in Annie's diabetes and her BGs were all over the range. Of course, I don't know if the problem was with our preparation, or because it was just early in her treatment that caused the wide swings in BG readings. Possibly other pups wouldn't have the same reaction with slightly different content.

I also may be naive and believe the dog food advertisements. They just make their recipe sound so good!

Give home cooking a try, no harm in trying, but if you see big swings in BG keep in mind meal repeatability MIGHT be part of the reason.

COMMENTS???

Craig

[kevbo887]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

Once again, thanks all!

Im going to try the home cooking for now, until the vet recommends what kind of dry food to eat. Right now hes on a healthy weight dry food, so im going to mix in some home cooked food with that.

Im really really hoping he will not need insulin, and maybe a more active lifestyle (he barely gets any exercise any more because of my impairments, I can barely walk for 5-10 minutes in a controlled environment) and healthier diet. My issue is of course his health, but also money. Something I have very little of being out of work right now. Yes, my wife works, but its tough running a house on one income, especially with all of my medical bills. But I guess when it rains, it pours! Im just really hoping that more activity, and healthier foods can prevent him from needing insulin as I just cannot afford it right now. The vet is already telling me we will do the blood work tuesday, and show me how to do insulin ect, and ill have to come in twice a week for a few weeks to monitor it, each time I go is more money we dont have. I know its horrible to say, because hes my best buddy and a family member, but I cant afford it. Hopefully ill be able to figure it out though, as I have no choice for my good boy Ace!

Hes so used to getting a lot of pupperoni, beggin strips, and beneful baked delights. I will openly admit, I abused them this past year with my injury and not being able to think. Hopefully getting rid of those can help a ton. I think he feels as though hes being punished right now by not getting excessive amounts of treats, but he will learn. I just keep praising him in the meantime to help out.

I took his Bg again at 11, and it was 164. So after eating scrambled eggs and healthy weight dog food he only raised 3 points.

My wife told me that the 291 reading could be her fault. As she had a brain fart and gave him a big ol pupperoni! She didnt even break it up into small pieces like I normal do. D'oh!

[CraigM]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

Understand your financial concerns.

Since you haven't started insulin injections yet, you might want to advise the vet you want to try Novolin-N insulin if insulin is required.

There are two common insulins used in the U.S. for dogs: Vetsulin and NPH insulin (Novolin-N and Humulin-N are the most common brands of NPH). Vetsulin is specifically made for dogs and many vets select this. At about $60 per 400 unit vial it can become expensive. Novolin-N is a human insulin that most (but not all dogs) can use. Novolin-N bought at Walmart (special contracted price) is only $25 for a 1000 unit vial, so if a pup can use it it is much less expensive.

Whatever insulin is selected, be sure the vet explains which syringe to use. Vetsulin and NPH insulins use different syringes and you want to have the correct syringe for the insulin being used.

Craig

[amydunn19]

Re: possibly diabetic maltese!?

I understand finances as well. I would make it clear to the vet that you would like to try the Novolin N first because it is the most affordable at Wal Mart for $24 a vial. I use it and many others use it on here. For a long time, vetsulin wasn't available because they took it off the market so that should be no problem.

If your dog has diabetes, a healthy lifestyle will help but being type 1, he will require insulin. This likely was not caused by treats - more likely genetic makeup, prolonged steroid therapy, or pancreatic trauma are just a few reasons dogs develop this disease and some bad luck.

Throw those pupperoni's away!

There are many different diets out there - it is not required that you use the prescription diet. It may be that you can use what you have. The key to managing diabetes is balancing food and insulin. My advice would be find a food he likes that is not at the high end of fat or protein and just balanced well. Some carb is needed to work with the insulin so you shouldn't avoid carbs.