Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

[VaHoo1]

Hey folks.. new here. We found out right before Christmas that our 8 year old 100 lb. chocolate lab was diabetic. Her BG was 430 at the time. She’s now on Levemir ..started at 5 units twice/day. We’ve been gradually increasing it. Now to 8 units twice/day. We feel like we went with the most potent insulin ..unfortunately the most costly as well. She has been responding well. For the first 6 weeks, her BG was around 200. Today we had it checked at it was at 400. Stupidly we changed her food 2 weeks ago so our vet thought that it may be the cause. We put her on her old food and will monitor for another week.

Our vet said not to raise the insulin levels until the next visit.. if needed ..which we agree. Ok.. a few questions please.

What is the consensus for the best type of food for a dog this size? We’re not home making it so any advice would be helpful. We have her back on Hills science diet light. We’re looking for the best OTC food

I’ve heard it’s difficult to monitor her BG levels at home. Can be painful and tough to get blood. Anyone a “pro?:”

Another question.. anyone using Levemir, what is the longest period you have found that it maintains efficacy.. we’ve kept it refrigerated for 45 days so far. Manufacturer states 42 but we’ve heard 60.

We have taken her completely off treats but... ellas diabetic cookies. Heard they’re ok.

Other than that, she barely if at all reacts to the injections.

Any other smart advice for a large dog! I’ve been reading the forum but know I am missing stuff.

Thanks in advance
VH

[MisterAlan]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

Hello. I have a husky that was around your dogs size but Ive gotten him down to his ideal weight of 70 lbs after strict diet control and over time i went from 12 units of vetsulin to 4.5 vetsulin twice a day now so there is hope of dropping the insulin once the dogs body is use to the food and insulin schedule. The only thing i can recommend is at home Blood testing and curving on your own because you can adjust faster than waiting until a doctor visit so you don't want your pup to be high BGs for prolonged periods of time. Since you have a big dog she might have a stubby part like a callus on her front legs elbow area where you can prick for the blood which is where i take the blood from on my pup and he doesn't even feel it the problem is getting him to stay still. As for food i have him on a self cooked diet where i can control the amount of carbs in his diet so his curve is basically flat after alot of tweaking and testing but it was worth the effort for me since its slowed his cataract to a stand still now so sorry cant help you on the bag diets. On the plus side adjusting insulin on a big dog is much easier than a smaller dog since a little change can have big swings for smaller pups but always have a karo syrup on hand incase your dogs sugars drop down and she does into hypoglycemia just rub it on the gums of the dog and feed her a small meal.

[jesse girl]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

Hi and welcome

Levemir is 4 times as potent as the other human insulin used alot like NPH by k9 diabetics so 4 units would work out to 16 units . Its a U-100 insulin and you can buy it at walmart without a prescription under the Relion name for $24 . Probably far cheaper than using Levemir but if its working well sometimes thats half the battle

I have used my jesse's inner lip above the canine tooth testing her blood sugar for over 10 years . There is no hair and very few nerve endings so no pain.Bigger dogs are far more easier than small because they have such big lips. You can do some practice tests rolling over the lip and exposing the inner portion above the canine tooth . Use a napkin to remove saliva . maybe use the back of a pencil or pen and have it represent a lancing device and place it on the lip then remove and wipe with a napkin . This gets your pup and you getting use to the routine before ever doing it for real .

Its not hard and fairly easy when you get the hang of it so I dont understand the comment its difficult to test blood sugar at home . There are vets that still dont want caretakers playing a big part in the management of the disease at home which to me makes no sense as you would not do that with human diabetics . I have not had a vet involved in jesses diabetes for 10 years

Remember complete curves done at home or at the vet need to be done to make sure you attain regulation in an adequate time period . As mister allan suggested it can slow the progress of cataracts and preserve site but most of all allot of grief and unwanted suffering . So thats the way you look at hometesting . Is it worth a little prick of a needle to give your dog a fairly normal healthy life ? I think so

[VaHoo1]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

Jesse girl... do you do the test daily or on a specific schedule? When you mention “Very few nerve endings” is she ever in pain when you take it? Also, you’re not talking about the gum above the canine tooth, your talking basically inside the lip? Am I correct?

When I mentioned “difficulty” it’s thru reading a lot of others experiences and also talking with my vet.

What test kit are you using?

Thanks for the reply

[jesse girl]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

Jesse is well past 16 now so I dont test her very much . He numbers are good when I spot check on occasion . There is no pain . Actually she would give me a lick after I did it . During the regulation period I may have tested her 5 times a day and when I did a curve once a week I tested 8 to 10 times

Now I started testing with the ear and that was difficult but the inner lip was no problem . Yes its the inside portion of the inner lip lined up with the canine tooth as that place has the most blood vessels

There are videos of dogs being tested there

[VaHoo1]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

Jesse is well past 16 now so I dont test her very much . He numbers are good when I spot check on occasion . There is no pain . Actually she would give me a lick after I did it . During the regulation period I may have tested her 5 times a day and when I did a curve once a week I tested 8 to 10 times

Now I started testing with the ear and that was difficult but the inner lip was no problem . Yes its the inside portion of the inner lip lined up with the canine tooth as that place has the most blood vessels

There are videos of dogs being tested there

Thank you..I’ve been researching test kits. Which one do you use or have used that gave the best results/easiest?

When you said 5x/day during the regulation period. That’s a lot of pin pricks. Regulation period? Was that the start?

Thank you and sorry for all the questions. Very new to this.

[jesse girl]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

Yes . the regulation period is the beginning and the time you are trying to get blood sugar stable and at acceptable level . Now what that is can be quite different for the individual dog .

The thing about K9 diabetes is each dog can be unique . What works for one dog may not for another and thats because of all the breeds shapes and sizes I presume . What we do know is the regulations process takes patience and a bit more work . Just like an exercise program you begin to do . Its a bit more difficult in the beginning and takes more work but given some time and perseverance your body gets use to the new program if you dont throw in the towel .Same with k9 diabetes . You get what you put into it

I have used a discount human meter for all of jesse's diabetic life and have no experience with the pet meters . Is it the best or the worse ? I don't know but it appears to be adequate and has gotten the job done . Nothing will be perfect . What is important is you can identify low blood sugar with your meter and patterns to make the correct adjustment during the regulation process . How long that takes depends on you and adhering to the simple protocols that have been established on this forum .

I use the prodigy auto code . I have compared it to other human meters and they have all been about the same as far as the numbers overall . I use the one touch Delica for my lance device . I do like this because it is short in length making it easier for testing the inner lip . I dont need the thicker lancets and can go fairly thin because the skin in the mouth is not thick while others testing on the body usually need thick lancets to penetrate the skin .

There is allot of information on the site . Educate yourself on the dos and don'ts and sorry to say vets do not have all the answers

[VaHoo1]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

Awesome.. thanks again Jesse Girl. Fortunately my daughter is a pharmacist so she can help us a bit with the decision making process. She’s new to “pet Pharma” so there’s that curve but she knows insulin well.

I have been reading a lot of this forum and there is some phenomenal information.

[Riliey and Mo]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

the best part of home testing is you are in control of blood sugar.
testing before meals at fasting is essential. waiting till the bg is over 200 before injecting
and doing a 12 hour curve taking blood every 2 hours before changing anything. insulin cant be increased just with one or two blood tests. increases or decreases depend on mostly on the lowest number of the curve results.

testings fun

[VaHoo1]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

Thanks for all the advice folks. Got the AlphaTrak monitoring system today and it couldn’t have been easier. Did it on the callous of her elbow. She didn’t feel it, results in seconds. Only problem is the lancet didn’t seem long enough so I had to push it a little harder. She acted like she felt nothing. This will make it so much easier!!

[jesse girl]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

Great and welcome to the hometesting club

Remember don't react to one individual test saying we need to fix this been there done that . Its the overall pattern thats important throughout the day and night for some

[VaHoo1]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

For the gurus! My monitor is literally all over the place! I take it from her elbow, it’s one reading, 10 secs later, I take it from her pad.. drastic change.. as much as 100 points different. Any ideas why? I have the AlphaTrak 2 and I’ve tested it, and set it up right! Is there a better monitor? Could mine be faulty? Helppppppp. Thx

[jesse girl]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

I have only tested the inner lip and I never had those difficulties but it could be 20 points off back to back

I have never used the pet meters so I cant comment on them but I would pick a location to test and stick with it

Testing is not going to be exact especially at higher levels but at lower level its pretty close

I think you should give it some time as your new to this and their could be some user error

[VaHoo1]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

I have only tested the inner lip and I never had those difficulties but it could be 20 points off back to back

I have never used the pet meters so I cant comment on them but I would pick a location to test and stick with it

Testing is not going to be exact especially at higher levels but at lower level its pretty close

I think you should give it some time as your new to this and their could be some user error

Thank you.. I’m actually going to bring it with me to my vet on Monday and compare readings. Yeah.. that’s my thought as well. Stick to one point.

[jesse girl]

Re: Newly diagnosed Chocolate Lab

Many do compare with the vet . I did early on but you must remember if comparing against another handheld device you could see similar results

The best thing to compare with is a lab analyzer that vets may not have but if they do that capability its very helpful because its accurate at all levels

just remember its not and exact science. Many manufacturers give a disclaimers that you could see 20% inaccuracy ( becomes more apparent at higher numbers and less at lower )

Most of us go through this and in a month or 2 you settle into a routine for you and you dog