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Old 08-03-2016, 10:32 AM
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luci5r luci5r is offline
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Default Siberian Husky - Planning to switch Insulin.

Hi,

I'm new to the forums here, so hello to all.

I have a Siberian Husky, "Neo", who just turned 9 this month. He's about 65lbs. He was diagnosed with Diabetes in 2013. Ever since he was diagnosed, he's been on Vetsulin, which I usually purchase from Allivet.Com, which has been the cheapest route. They charge $36.99 per 10ml vial, plus $27 for Cold Shipping (Overnight), and I typically get 4 vials at a time since Shipping is the same whether you get 1 or 4. They also require a prescription for the same.

He gets 15 units twice a day. He also has hypothyroid for which he gets 0.8mg of Levothyroxine once a day; and being prone to infections from allergies, I give him Allertec (Costco brand of Zyrtec) once a day - which has tremendously helped in alleviating infections from allergies.

I recently came across articles about a Wal-mart brand of Insulin that most pet owners with canine diabetes have been using, specifically for cost reasons, and also because prescription isn't required.

I've seen some conflicting information about availability - I believe it was called Novolin N first, then ReliOn, and now it's supposed to be called Humulin N. I'm not really positive.

I do understand that the syringes also switch to U-100 (as opposed to U-40, which I typically use with Vetsulin).

Just wanted to get some basic information. I live in Southern California, and they just opened a super Wal-mart in Burbank, not far from where I live. If someone here can share any information about what I should be looking for, if it's even available anymore, what kind of options I might have, that would be really awesome!
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Old 08-03-2016, 11:09 AM
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amydunn19 amydunn19 is offline
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Default Re: Siberian Husky - Planning to switch Insulin.

Hi and welcome! The insulin you are referring to is Novolin N - it is a special contract they have exclusively with Wal Mart. They have their brand printed on the boxes (Relion is Wal Mart's branding name for supplies/meds) but the product is the same. For several years, they had the contract with Eli Lilly and the name of the same insulin was Humulin N. So, it has been both brands at one time or the other. Both are NPH insulins, intermediate acting and similar to Vetsulin. Vetsulin is just made differently and supposedly has two peaks but that really depends on the dog and some have about the same results as with NPH. The duration is supposed to be about the same - some dogs get more or less duration but they are designed to be 12 hours. Most start the dosage lower (a unit or two lower) when switching just in case there is a strong response, but many end up on the same dose.

I always used the Wal Mart insulin(both Humulin and Novolin). Vetsulin was off the market for many years because of the instability (something in manufacturing had to be worked out to make it more shelf stable)and when it came back, I didn't want to change because Maggie did really well on the NPH insulin.
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Old 08-03-2016, 11:15 AM
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luci5r luci5r is offline
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Default Re: Siberian Husky - Planning to switch Insulin.

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Originally Posted by amydunn19 View Post
Hi and welcome! The insulin you are referring to is Novolin N - it is a special contract they have exclusively with Wal Mart. They have their brand printed on the boxes (Relion is Wal Mart's branding name for supplies/meds) but the product is the same. For several years, they had the contract with Eli Lilly and the name of the same insulin was Humulin N. So, it has been both brands at one time or the other. Both are NPH insulins, intermediate acting and similar to Vetsulin. Vetsulin is just made differently and supposedly has two peaks but that really depends on the dog and some have about the same results as with NPH. The duration is supposed to be about the same - some dogs get more or less duration but they are designed to be 12 hours. Most start the dosage lower (a unit or two lower) when switching just in case there is a strong response, but many end up on the same dose.

I always used the Wal Mart insulin(both Humulin and Novolin). Vetsulin was off the market for many years because of the instability (something in manufacturing had to be worked out to make it more shelf stable)and when it came back, I didn't want to change because Maggie did really well on the NPH insulin.
Amy,

Thank you so much for your very detailed response. This was very informative & cleared up some of my confusion.

So essentially I'm looking for Novolin N at Wal-mart. I'll stop by the Burbank Wal-mart this weekend to see if I can get them there. I'm assuming these use the U-100 Syringes?

Do you know if they require a prescription for these? Or if the policy differs from store to store?

If the pricing is any lower then what I pay for Vetsulin, I would definitely like to try to switch & see how Neo does with it.

Thanks for your help.
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Old 08-03-2016, 12:23 PM
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MikeMurphy MikeMurphy is offline
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Default Re: Siberian Husky - Planning to switch Insulin.

Hi and welcome to the forum!

As Amy mentioned, this is Walmart's Relion Novolin N insulin and Relion syringes that many of us use. I like the short needle syringes because they have half unit increments up to 30 units.

In New York State, we need a prescription for the syringes but not the insulin.

The Relion Novolin N is < $25 per vial.




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Lily is a 62 lb English Setter, born 07-27-2007.
Diabetes: Aug 2013 - Hypothyroidism: Dec 2013 - Cataract Surgery: Feb 2014
Insulin: Novolin R/N mix - Meter: ReliOn Prime
Nulo Adult Trim Cod & Lentils, Pumpkin, FortiFlora, Dasuquin, Thyroxine
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Old 08-03-2016, 12:45 PM
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Default Re: Siberian Husky - Planning to switch Insulin.

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Originally Posted by MikeMurphy View Post
Hi and welcome to the forum!

As Amy mentioned, this is Walmart's Relion Novolin N insulin and Relion syringes that many of us use. I like the short needle syringes because they have half unit increments up to 30 units.

In New York State, we need a prescription for the syringes but not the insulin.

The Relion Novolin N is < $25 per vial.




Mike,

That was EXTREMELY helpful! Thanks for the pictures and the detail. This is very promising. I will be sure to check with my Wal-mart this weekend and see if I can get the ReliOn Novolin N. It seems like Allivet.Com does sell the U-100 Insulin Syringes without a prescription here in California. If I can get the ReliOn Syringes from Wal-mart without a prescription, that's great, otherwise I'll go with Allivet.

I also want to look at home monitoring of Neo's blood-sugar levels. I believe some devices like ReliOn Prime are available for the same. I just need to take a look at how to use them.

Thanks again for all your help.
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Old 08-03-2016, 12:51 PM
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Default Re: Siberian Husky - Planning to switch Insulin.

Welcome to you and Neo.

Novolin-N from Walmart ($25/vial), and U-100 syringes ($12.88 I think) should be much less expensive than Vetsulin with U-40 syringes. First, the price of the vial, then the concentration is 2.5 times stronger: you get 1000 units of Novolin-N in the same physical size vial as the Vetsulin's 400 unit vial. Very important to switch to the U-100 syringe.

Different States, and local laws, may require a prescription for the insulin or syringe. Some locations may limit the number of syringes you can buy at one time. Best to just ask at the pharmacy. I've never had a problem at the 4-5 different Walmart's I've shopped at.

The photo that Mike posted are the syringes I try to get, but once or twice they have been out of the 31 gauge and I just went with the 30 gauge.

Craig
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Old 08-03-2016, 01:15 PM
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luci5r luci5r is offline
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Default Re: Siberian Husky - Planning to switch Insulin.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CraigM View Post
Welcome to you and Neo.

Novolin-N from Walmart ($25/vial), and U-100 syringes ($12.88 I think) should be much less expensive than Vetsulin with U-40 syringes. First, the price of the vial, then the concentration is 2.5 times stronger: you get 1000 units of Novolin-N in the same physical size vial as the Vetsulin's 400 unit vial. Very important to switch to the U-100 syringe.

Different States, and local laws, may require a prescription for the insulin or syringe. Some locations may limit the number of syringes you can buy at one time. Best to just ask at the pharmacy. I've never had a problem at the 4-5 different Walmart's I've shopped at.

The photo that Mike posted are the syringes I try to get, but once or twice they have been out of the 31 gauge and I just went with the 30 gauge.

Craig
Craig,

Thanks a ton for the wealth of information up there. I have a question about something you wrote.

You mentioned Novolin-N is 2.5 times stronger (due to concentration) from VetSulin. Currently I'm giving Neo 15 Units of VetSulin twice a day, morning & evening.

If I get Novolin-N, and it has 1000 Units packed in the same physical size as the 400 Unit vial of VetSulin, does that mean I need to adjust my dosage to match the 2.5 times strength? In other words, will I be starting Neo off with 15 Units of Novolin-N or much less?

Thanks so much for all your help.
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Old 08-03-2016, 01:28 PM
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Default Re: Siberian Husky - Planning to switch Insulin.

Minnesota is the same. No prescription for the insulin but prescription needed if you buy more than 10 (1 package) of syringes at a time.

I became kind of a syringe hoarder. When Jenny died I gave away about 7 or 8 boxes

you can buy online without a prescription so I did that and/or stocked up when visiting my family in Indiana.

Here is a link to some syringes that were more comfortable for my dog. Another member here had sent me some to try. And sent me more when her Abby passed. She was also a syringe hoarder.

https://www.healthwarehouse.com/sure...unt-19723.html

we used the smallest because my girl was small. You might need a bigger size.

Judi

ps. Just go to the pharmacy and tell them you want the "N" insulin.
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Old 08-03-2016, 01:35 PM
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Default Re: Siberian Husky - Planning to switch Insulin.

Quote:
Originally Posted by luci5r View Post
Craig,

Thanks a ton for the wealth of information up there. I have a question about something you wrote.

You mentioned Novolin-N is 2.5 times stronger (due to concentration) from VetSulin. Currently I'm giving Neo 15 Units of VetSulin twice a day, morning & evening.

If I get Novolin-N, and it has 1000 Units packed in the same physical size as the 400 Unit vial of VetSulin, does that mean I need to adjust my dosage to match the 2.5 times strength? In other words, will I be starting Neo off with 15 Units of Novolin-N or much less?

Thanks so much for all your help.
Nope, that's why we switch to U-100 syringes. Once you get your U-100 syringes it will be obvious when you compare them to the U-40 syringe.

For example: if you would fill both syringes to the 10 mark, the U-40 syringe would actually contain 2 times more liquid. All we need to do is ensure the the syringes match the insulin.

Craig
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Annie was an 18 pound Lhasa Apso that crossed the rainbow bridge on 10-5-17. She was nearly 17 years old and diabetic for 9 years.
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  #10  
Old 08-03-2016, 02:53 PM
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luci5r luci5r is offline
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Default Re: Siberian Husky - Planning to switch Insulin.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Judi View Post
Minnesota is the same. No prescription for the insulin but prescription needed if you buy more than 10 (1 package) of syringes at a time.

I became kind of a syringe hoarder. When Jenny died I gave away about 7 or 8 boxes

you can buy online without a prescription so I did that and/or stocked up when visiting my family in Indiana.

Here is a link to some syringes that were more comfortable for my dog. Another member here had sent me some to try. And sent me more when her Abby passed. She was also a syringe hoarder.

https://www.healthwarehouse.com/sure...unt-19723.html

we used the smallest because my girl was small. You might need a bigger size.

Judi

ps. Just go to the pharmacy and tell them you want the "N" insulin.
Judi,

Thanks so much for writing in. I'm actually finding that you can get U-100 syringes without prescription online on quite a few websites, including Allivet which is what I had been using.

Thanks also for sharing the link; I'll definitely keep that handy & give those a try.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CraigM View Post
Nope, that's why we switch to U-100 syringes. Once you get your U-100 syringes it will be obvious when you compare them to the U-40 syringe.

For example: if you would fill both syringes to the 10 mark, the U-40 syringe would actually contain 2 times more liquid. All we need to do is ensure the the syringes match the insulin.

Craig
Craig,

THANKS again - I understand exactly what you mean. The measurements on the two types of syringes are different to accommodate the concentration level. It appears Novolin-N is definitely going to be vastly more economical then VetSulin.

It's almost irritating I didn't look into this sooner.

Quick Question, would these U-100 Syringes at Allivet be the right kind?
http://www.allivet.com/p-2731-insuli...ges-u-100.aspx

They are available without prescription and come in 3/10cc, 0.5cc & 1cc. This would only be helpful if my Wal-mart doesn't carry the ReliOn Syringes pictured above, or require prescription for them.

Thanks everyone.
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