Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

[bichons9]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

Riley and Mo..Suzie is 9.6 lbs so with 70/30, I would start with 2.25u??? Is there any shaft that guides one?https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1091352167

[bichons9]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

Sibhus..You get a post meal spike soon after eating with vetsulin or 70/30?https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...gid=1091352167

[bichons9]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

BP cooper...Suzie (13.5yrs) eats 46g Ruby Stewbie (less carrots and the chana dal+ 60 g chicken. Now, she won't eat the chicken breast so Frank bought no additive chicken breast but won't eat it..STRANGE..He replaced chicken with ground hamburger (sirloin) and she eats fine??..Nothing makes sense anymore unless sometging is very worng with Suzie and is not showing in labs..If her Hct doesn't keep increasing (which is so far), DVM wants to perform ct scan and endoscopy to check for ulcer? or bleeding? I need to find and expert soon.

[bichons9]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

BP Cooper ...I saw the 462 vs 128 vs 2something...The inconsistency and lack of predictability of Vetsulin has me crazy after 2 years+ of it..I recently read about animals killed by vetsulin in 2009 due to instability..and also started wondering if 1/3 dogs get it only once/24 hrs and 2/3 get it 2X/ 24 hrs, is the Insulin changing its length of action at times causing lows when you would expect a high. Shake..don't shake..We shake and roll..though one DVM says shaking can damage molecules hitting side of vial..Who knows!!!! Anyway,,I appreciate all of this info

[bichons9]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

Jesse girl..Her BG was "predicatble" on Lantus but never slept worrying if BG would drop too low at 4 am. I just can't find any "person" selling it lately. No BG curves have ever been great on Vetsulin.

[jesse girl]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

I do understand how you feel . Been there done that . For my jesse the thing that had the largest affect was switching her to one meal a day with a small snack . Now the reason I suggested trying NPH first is because you tried lantus with good success . This is suppose to be a slow absorption insulin with no fast acting component . Now Nph is faster in absorption but has no fast acting component

The key to 70/30 is if your dog gets a spike after eating before the NPH would kick in and the R ( fast acting ) would move to settle the food spike and usually gets going in a half hour .

Now I dont see any evidence of a meal spike in sugar from the numbers you posted but you dont have many tests at that 2 hour mark after meal to really confirm that thought

Mostly what I see is rebound. If the numbers start off high at shot time your dog will drop and the higher the level the bigger the drop and then then the rebound back up off that big drop . Now if starting at a lower number at insulin time you will get a spike sooner which is understandable as the body recognizes I got a bunch of insulin going into me and I dont have enough blood sugar to deal with it so you get a spike and a type of rebound

What happens I believe its not so much about food as the body trying to balance out injected insulin and the only way it can do that is through stored sugar and it struggles to control that and many times it just opens the flood gates to preserve life so not to go to low and you are left with higher sugar

The problem is not the higher sugar . Its the bodies response to the lower sugar with stored glucose

The key to better control is a flatter curve and actually you want to bring the lower number up which you would expect would bring the higher numbers down .

I have been guilty of paying more attention to the higher numbers over the lower numbers but the higher number maybe a consequence of the lower numbers . Now this is my theory and there is some medical evidence to substantiate that thought but its all a theory because we cant test where that sugar comes from. The body or directly from food or a combination of both . This is why it can be difficult to figure and most dogs never get close to what normal blood sugar looks like

[bichons9]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

Past 2 days with higher dose high BG curve but no crazy numbers..Just now..back to "CRAZY" BG 130 @10:30 AM...BG 518 @12:20 PM...

[bichons9]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

is there a protocol for dosing when switching from Vetsulin to Novolin 70/30? Thanks for your info!!!!

[Raysaint]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

With Lantus, you say predictable ( that makes some sense), but we're the numbers and curves good enough to say she was " regulated"?

Reason I ask is because a new insulin, Tresiba, is becoming a more recommended one for humans. It is flatter than Lantus, in terms of consistent strength over 24 hours. Lantus does have a bit of a slow peak.

And Tresiba, if I remember, is a straight dose crossover from Lantus. I personally used to use Lantus, 48 units at bedtime, then my doctor switched me to Tresiba, 48 units at bedtime.

[bichons9]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

I guess not since went to Vetsulin...but would have to look back to 2017 to see how the Lantus worked...

[sibhus]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

Bichons9, As to your question about the post meal spike, my dog basically spikes at 400 with type N insulin after 45mins of giving insulin, he is given insulin right when he finishes food which is usually 9pm. Referring to my libre data which are one minute samples, With the 70 30 the spike peaks at 260 after 45 min of giving insulin, he then goes down to 170 after 2 hours which is the first nadir, goes up to 210 at 3 hours and then comes down to 170 about 4.5 hours later which is nadir 2, then slowly climbs up to 240 after the 12 hour mark. Hopefully this makes sense.

As to efficacy of 70-30, I actually noticed an immediate difference the day I switched to it from N, however I was worried he would go hypoglycemic. I would strongly recommend you use the Libre to see how he responds with 70 30 unless your willing to take 30 minute samples with AT2 strips for the first few hours. Also the 70 30 is designed to be used with the U100 needles, as I see your using vetsulin which I think uses U40.

[Riliey and Mo]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

one site with 70/30 info:

search insite insulins 70/30

www.diabetesindogs.fandom.com

[Riliey and Mo]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

theres 2 dogs on this thread

can somebody move to individual threads for easier reading

[bichons9]

Re: Vetsulin vs. Novolin N vs. Novolin 70/30

I'm sorry I thought this was the thread/post that I started but just realized mine was, " "Has anyone switched from VETSULIN to NOVOLIN 70/30??" I'm not sure how to do what you are asking