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  • #46
    Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

    Originally posted by Linda G. View Post
    Katie is still on 2u Novolin twice a day. I test her fasting before food and have gotten readings like 135/165/162/148. I have found she drops after eating sometimes so if that fasting number is lower like this I wait 30 to 50 min., and retest before injecting. Lately she frequently either hardly goes up in that time frame or sometimes is a few points lower even so I reduce her dose. Is this a sign her injection from 12 hours prior is still working or what, and how do you recommend handling this?
    Although I don't have THAT problem, it does sound like she is still using the insulin from the previous injection. What are you feeding? Maybe add something that she digests quickly that is "carby", like a standard dog treat as dessert?

    How much of a drop are you really seeing? If the drop is still above 100ish, why even bother?

    Craig
    Annie was an 18 pound Lhasa Apso that crossed the rainbow bridge on 10-5-17. She was nearly 17 years old and diabetic for 9½ years.

    Comment


    • #47
      Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

      Originally posted by CraigM View Post
      Although I don't have THAT problem, it does sound like she is still using the insulin from the previous injection. What are you feeding? Maybe add something that she digests quickly that is "carby", like a standard dog treat as dessert?

      How much of a drop are you really seeing? If the drop is still above 100ish, why even bother?

      Craig
      Craig, Katie has other health issues GI related and it's complicated. We've been to a couple vets since her diagnosis 9 wks ago and emergency clinic twice and seen an IMS twice with u/s run. We are currently seeing an integrative vet who is running some tests and helping me with the GI/IBD flare she has been in after another diabetes group tried to help me find a better plan for feeding and adjusting her meal timing to suit the diabetes. She has to have 4 small meals a day due to the GI thing so we are 'unique' which is why admin of other other diabetes group recommended k9 diabetes group for us. BUT we are doing better! Her last meal and injection is at 8PM. It consists of (the only food she is able to eat at this point) Hills ZD well soaked dry and ZD canned. Also a little pumpkin for a pill or supplement and tsp yogurt. In the middle of the night I give her a treat to have something on her stomach. We have had 4 good nights/mornings on her new supplements and Tylan med Integrative vet put her on. She had been on Metronidazole which was seeming to make matters worse- air licking, nausea..inappetance. My other group recommends not giving insulin unless BG closer to 200. If she tests say 160 at 8am and maybe only 170 50 min. later after eating they say to reduce the dose. My understanding is there is a one hour window to give insulin after the meal, correct?
      Katie/11yr old spayed Westie 19.4 lbs/primary issue of GI sensitivities, food and skin allergies/ diagnosed diabetic 10-19-15/ 2U Novolin BID/

      Comment


      • #48
        Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

        Katie has extra problems that are above my knowledge level.

        Not sure why the other group recommends not giving insulin (delaying) if the pup is much below 200. This might be a recommendation just for Katie's condition? When you wait until she rises above 200ish, how high does she go later in the day? Guess this is individual for each pup.

        Craig
        Annie was an 18 pound Lhasa Apso that crossed the rainbow bridge on 10-5-17. She was nearly 17 years old and diabetic for 9½ years.

        Comment


        • #49
          Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

          Originally posted by CraigM View Post
          Katie has extra problems that are above my knowledge level.

          Not sure why the other group recommends not giving insulin (delaying) if the pup is much below 200. This might be a recommendation just for Katie's condition? When you wait until she rises above 200ish, how high does she go later in the day? Guess this is individual for each pup.

          Craig
          Craig the other group has a suggested insulin dosing adjustment based on BG or if dog eats only partial meal. They say each unit insulin has potential to drop BG 100pts. So if dog was testing 175 just before the shot and you give full dose it could potentially drop into concerning level. Or, if dog was testing 175 and has full dose on board, and the dog gets really excited due to over barking, UPS truck- whatever it could bring level down to a concerning level. I personally will give full dose if she's say 185 or higher. One day recently I tested her at 8am fasting and she was 140. Fed her full meal, waited maybe 20 min., re tested at 104, waited almost the full hour and she was only 112 so gave her quarter of a dose. You can certainly tell me how this group handles such readings, I would appreciate it Her numbers can be all over the place plus we've had this awful GI issue going on since I tried to give her more food at one meal and also tried giving low carb meals mid day in place of ZD and it caused GI inflammation and a flare of her IBD. She typically goes higher around 4pm to 8pm if I test her at those times. Dec 13 at 8pm she tested 443. Dec. 16 at 8pm she was 425. However now that she's feeling better GI wise with new prebiotic and Tylan vet has her on she's stayed 135 to 283 which thrills me to no end but I hesitate to say it too loudly her GI issues have to be priority and then I work around her diabetes best as I can. She's doing SO much better last 3 days, happy her, happy me.
          Katie/11yr old spayed Westie 19.4 lbs/primary issue of GI sensitivities, food and skin allergies/ diagnosed diabetic 10-19-15/ 2U Novolin BID/

          Comment


          • #50
            Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

            The total dose per day of 4 units for a 20 lb dog that is staying in really reasonable glucose levels is an indication that Katie may still be honeymooning. That is that she still produces some insulin of her own. It is not that uncommon, and can go on for a few months or longer.

            To also complicate things, her GI issues may cause her to digest her food at a different rate from one feeding or one day to the next. That will obviously affect the blood glucose readings. As far as dropping or rising 20 points, unfortunately that is still within the margin of error for these meters even the alphatrak. I have on occasion tested the same blood drop twice with the same meter (alphatrak) and got readings varying by at least 20 points or so.

            If I remember correctly you are feeding a full meal at 8am, half meal at noon and half again at 4pm? Then the next full meal at 8pm with a small treat at 2am. So the insulin dose should not be the same from morning to evening. The first shot of the day is covering 12 hrs plus the equivalent of 2 full meals. The next is covering 12 hrs one meal and a small treat.

            If you backed off that shot at the 8pm injection, to say 1.5 units instead of 2 she might not be still using that at 8am. If she was a bit higher in the morning , you would feel more comfortable giving her the remaining 2.5 units and it would tend to last longer giving you a better reading at 8pm. It is difficult for that 8am shot of 2 units to last thru the 12 hrs plus feedings at noon and especially the one at 4pm, as the insulin should be waning at that point. If you are getting good numbers with the current schedule and injections, to me that definitely points to honeymooning.

            On the waiting for the injection till she reaches a pre-determined glucose level, that is entirely dependent on her full curve. If she has what is commonly referred to as a mountain curve, as in starting at your 8am reading (140ish) and goes up reliably from there to high 100s or over 200 at the peak before she drops again it is perfectly safe to give the shot.

            If she has a big drop after the insulin injection, then you need to work at getting that number higher at fasting. Less insulin etc. I realize that the spacing of the meals is necessary, but because of that the normal "rules" of injections (if there are such a thing) do not apply.

            I personally do not think that there is any hard and fast rule on diabetic dogs. So many of us have dogs with multiple problems plus the fact that every single dog reacts differently to both food and insulin. What works for one may be a disaster for another.

            Since you are very knowledgeable about her GI issues, you will be able to figure this out shortly. The more you can test her, not just at fasting but in between and document everything, the sooner you will come to a solution that fits Katie and her schedule.

            I still think she is honeymooning, and until that ceases you just have to be reactionary and adjust on a day to day basis. My first diabetic pug Bella did that for about 3 months, and I did not know enough about it to keep her in good ranges. My second diabetic pug Emmitt honeymooned for even longer. I just thought I was doing a really great job at regulating him. LOL When he stopped producing insulin altogether, I found out how hard he was to regulate in the real world with his many other issues. Quite a blow to the old ego I might add. My third diabetic pug Lindy is relatively easy. But I am sure this too will end. One thing to realize in the process, is that things constantly change, and possibly even more for you and Katie with her serious GI issues.
            Take Care Joan
            Last edited by Joan; 12-19-2015, 01:56 PM.

            Comment


            • #51
              Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

              Originally posted by Joan View Post
              The total dose per day of 4 units for a 20 lb dog that is staying in really reasonable glucose levels is an indication that Katie may still be honeymooning. That is that she still produces some insulin of her own. It is not that uncommon, and can go on for a few months or longer.

              To also complicate things, her GI issues may cause her to digest her food at a different rate from one feeding or one day to the next. That will obviously affect the blood glucose readings. As far as dropping or rising 20 points, unfortunately that is still within the margin of error for these meters even the alphatrak. I have on occasion tested the same blood drop twice with the same meter (alphatrak) and got readings varying by at least 20 points or so.

              If I remember correctly you are feeding a full meal at 8am, half meal at noon and half again at 4pm? Then the next full meal at 8pm with a small treat at 2am. So the insulin dose should not be the same from morning to evening. The first shot of the day is covering 12 hrs plus the equivalent of 2 full meals. The next is covering 12 hrs one meal and a small treat.

              If you backed off that shot at the 8pm injection, to say 1.5 units instead of 2 she might not be still using that at 8am. If she was a bit higher in the morning , you would feel more comfortable giving her the remaining 2.5 units and it would tend to last longer giving you a better reading at 8pm. It is difficult for that 8am shot of 2 units to last thru the 12 hrs plus feedings at noon and especially the one at 4pm, as the insulin should be waning at that point. If you are getting good numbers with the current schedule and injections, to me that definitely points to honeymooning.

              On the waiting for the injection till she reaches a pre-determined glucose level, that is entirely dependent on her full curve. If she has what is commonly referred to as a mountain curve, as in starting at your 8am reading (140ish) and goes up reliably from there to high 100s or over 200 at the peak before she drops again it is perfectly safe to give the shot.

              If she has a big drop after the insulin injection, then you need to work at getting that number higher at fasting. Less insulin etc. I realize that the spacing of the meals is necessary, but because of that the normal "rules" of injections (if there are such a thing) do not apply.

              I personally do not think that there is any hard and fast rule on diabetic dogs. So many of us have dogs with multiple problems plus the fact that every single dog reacts differently to both food and insulin. What works for one may be a disaster for another.

              Since you are very knowledgeable about her GI issues, you will be able to figure this out shortly. The more you can test her, not just at fasting but in between and document everything, the sooner you will come to a solution that fits Katie and her schedule.

              I still think she is honeymooning, and until that ceases you just have to be reactionary and adjust on a day to day basis. My first diabetic pug Bella did that for about 3 months, and I did not know enough about it to keep her in good ranges. My second diabetic pug Emmitt honeymooned for even longer. I just thought I was doing a really great job at regulating him. LOL When he stopped producing insulin altogether, I found out how hard he was to regulate in the real world with his many other issues. Quite a blow to the old ego I might add. My third diabetic pug Lindy is relatively easy. But I am sure this too will end. One thing to realize in the process, is that things constantly change, and possibly even more for you and Katie with her serious GI issues.
              Take Care Joan
              Many thanks again Joan. I sent an email to you a few days ago, not sure if you got it. We had email and computer problems that very same day and I lost many emails unfortunately. I'm glad to hear from you today, hope things are ok in your world. I have once again printed out your reply today. I think one problem with our situation is there have been many changes in the past 9 weeks since diagnosis and that has not helped my girl. She was on Vetsulin to start with, I did a curve after a couple weeks, her vet advised we drop night time insulin to 2.5 (as you just suggested). Then she recommended we try to stretch her meal times out some to improve her curve just a bit later in the day. Then we tried the WD food many use and that bothered Katie pretty quick so back to her ZD. At 4 weeks I opened a new Vetsulin vial and we had awful, crazy numbers on it. I swear something was wrong with it, so after 2 weeks I kind of on my own switched to Novolin N which has seemed to be a better fit as my other group thought it might be. Then the group was trying to help me give more food/calories at the 8am/pm feedings so more food, less at noon/4pm meals. We tried low to no carb meals at the 2 mid day meals. It sent Katie into a huge GI flare (the types of food), not wanting to eat many mornings, nauseated, inflammation. Ugh. Our regular vet was off sick for a week so saw new young vet who was, (like most people I share our story with), a bit perplexed. She gave me Metronidazole. It seems that didn't agree with Katie and only added to her GI problem which was in full flare. So off to the Intergrative Vet who I am feeling very good about. He has 30 yrs as a vet and is well known here. He adjusted her supplements and Tylan instead of Metro. She's on a great GI Support product, better than what I was using. I can't believe the difference in her in 3-4 days now. She sleeps through the night, wakes up wants to eat, no air licking. I know it may not last but for now we are all sleeping better and feeling less anxious. So when you suggest lowering 8pm dose I think that's a good thing to try. Our regular vet does not like doing that and I haven't asked the Integrative vet but will. I'm waiting for a couple tests he ran and for him to call about those so will ask on the dose question. Incidentally her noon and 4pm meals are not that much less food. Then, depending on what he says about the test results, I'll run a curve a few days after any changes settle in. Btw the 2 middle meals are about 1/8 c of dry, and a bit less canned than other meals. She has to have more calories in her day (not really getting enough) and if I try to add more dry food into the 8am/pm meals it seems to cause trouble even going slowly. I give her 1/4c dry and 2 tsp canned at her insulin meals, also some yogurt and pumpkin (for pills). We even managed to stop setting alarm at 2am to feed her small snack. I have a bag of her pre diabetes treats that she likes by the bed and just give her one when I wake up in the night. I wonder, as her GI and digestion settle down if that's the reason for lower numbers. I hear you about the honeymooning. Thank you Joan.
              Katie/11yr old spayed Westie 19.4 lbs/primary issue of GI sensitivities, food and skin allergies/ diagnosed diabetic 10-19-15/ 2U Novolin BID/

              Comment


              • #52
                Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

                Glad things are going better for Katie & you. Just to be clear, I was not trying to change your meal times and amts, just trying to give you some help to match up the insulin. You are definitely on top of her GI issues, and know her better than anyone....so take your vets advice under advisement and then modify to what you know will work for her. Sometimes what the vets don't know won't hurt them LOL

                What GI supplement did your vet change to? Glad it is working. I had a pug yrs ago that had an allergy to chicken, vet put him on ZD and he was actually worse. Vet said that happens sometimes. Ended up on lamb for lots of yrs till he passed at 15.

                Comment


                • #53
                  Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

                  Originally posted by Joan View Post
                  Glad things are going better for Katie & you. Just to be clear, I was not trying to change your meal times and amts, just trying to give you some help to match up the insulin. You are definitely on top of her GI issues, and know her better than anyone....so take your vets advice under advisement and then modify to what you know will work for her. Sometimes what the vets don't know won't hurt them LOL

                  What GI supplement did your vet change to? Glad it is working. I had a pug yrs ago that had an allergy to chicken, vet put him on ZD and he was actually worse. Vet said that happens sometimes. Ended up on lamb for lots of yrs till he passed at 15.
                  He put her on 2Docs GI Defense which is a pre and probiotic he likes better than the Udos Super 8 and VSL3 probiotic (human supplements) I had her on for a few years. His contains, among other good things, slippery elm which is suggested on my IBD forum. I think the Tylan med has also helped and is another popular med on my IBD group. She remains on Hepato Support, CurCuvet, VetriDMG drops, (all of which the integrative vet likes), and Ranitidine (Zyrtec) 1/4 of a tab twice a day. I also have something he had made up for her which he said is similar to pepto but has flavor dogs like. It's only to use if she's having a flare and feeling sick, not eating. I haven't needed it so far. Btw I just tested, she was 313 at 8pm. Fed her full meal, and decided I will give 1.5 U tonight.
                  Katie/11yr old spayed Westie 19.4 lbs/primary issue of GI sensitivities, food and skin allergies/ diagnosed diabetic 10-19-15/ 2U Novolin BID/

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

                    Hi Linda
                    Joan did manage to reach me in a pm. Apologies Joan, I did receive your email but we are in full blown renovations so we can relist our house in March.

                    In my case Linda, I did care for a diabetic Westie in the past but his problems was sludge in the bile ducts which caused erratic digestion.

                    Currently, I adopted a rescue Westie whose previous owner had neglected to have him treated for whipworms which caused significant damage to the lining of the stomach and gut and which triggered the IBD. I am very familiar with the gurgling sounds that you can hear across the room, the vomiting of bile. In Angus' case, it was coming out bloody from both ends. I read through your thread and it doesn't appear that your little one has as much damage internally other than probably major irritation to the stomach because of the regular building/vomiting of bile.

                    What really helped my Angus was to introduce SeaCure which is a hydrolized fish protein. It doesn't cure overnight but in his case, the episodes were further and further apart and now, I don't remember the last time he vomited. He now has Addison's and doing well. I give SeaCure (chewable tablet) at lunch and dinner. Everyone I have suggested it to have seen remarkable changes. I tried the pepcid Ac, anti nausea meds, etc, and if you go the Tylan route, I definitely would not do it for too long. With IBD, you need a permanent regimen.

                    In the morning, I just give him a heaping tablespoon of fish (choice of cod, tuna, salmon, tilapia or sardines). The odd time, he won't eat food, eat grass but no vomiting or gurgling. Then a small meal at lunch and dinner,(I serve Natural Balance limited ingredients sweet potatoes and venison or bison) soak the kibbles as it is easier to digest and add some boiled ground beef or turkey, or pork, in addition to the probiotics, digestive enzymes and 1/4 teaspoon of pumpkin. A biscuit at 9ish, another biscuit at bedtime. Occasionally, a bone around 7ish and some fruit or veggies in the afternoon. I think with IBD, it is important to have a little food in their tummy at all time in order to prevent the build up of bile.

                    If you don't want to go the SeaCure route, you could give L-glutamine which you can get in Health Food Stores. This helps heal the lining of the digestive tract and damaged intestinal lining.

                    I also read that you give probiotics and digestive enzymes which is great. A 3rd suggestion would be to consider Bertes Digestion Blend which contains probiotics, digestive enzymes as well as l-glutamine all in one.

                    I would agree with others in saying that the priority is to be concerned with the IBD first, feed accordingly and inject (up to 4 times if required) to treat the diabetes. IBD sufferers definitely cannot tolerate large meals

                    Sorry for being so wordy and long.

                    Good luck with your baby

                    Louise

                    PS: Joan, I'll send you an email to let you know what is happening

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

                      Originally posted by buddingartist View Post
                      Hi Linda
                      Joan did manage to reach me in a pm. Apologies Joan, I did receive your email but we are in full blown renovations so we can relist our house in March.

                      In my case Linda, I did care for a diabetic Westie in the past but his problems was sludge in the bile ducts which caused erratic digestion.

                      Currently, I adopted a rescue Westie whose previous owner had neglected to have him treated for whipworms which caused significant damage to the lining of the stomach and gut and which triggered the IBD. I am very familiar with the gurgling sounds that you can hear across the room, the vomiting of bile. In Angus' case, it was coming out bloody from both ends. I read through your thread and it doesn't appear that your little one has as much damage internally other than probably major irritation to the stomach because of the regular building/vomiting of bile.

                      What really helped my Angus was to introduce SeaCure which is a hydrolized fish protein. It doesn't cure overnight but in his case, the episodes were further and further apart and now, I don't remember the last time he vomited. He now has Addison's and doing well. I give SeaCure (chewable tablet) at lunch and dinner. Everyone I have suggested it to have seen remarkable changes. I tried the pepcid Ac, anti nausea meds, etc, and if you go the Tylan route, I definitely would not do it for too long. With IBD, you need a permanent regimen.

                      In the morning, I just give him a heaping tablespoon of fish (choice of cod, tuna, salmon, tilapia or sardines). The odd time, he won't eat food, eat grass but no vomiting or gurgling. Then a small meal at lunch and dinner,(I serve Natural Balance limited ingredients sweet potatoes and venison or bison) soak the kibbles as it is easier to digest and add some boiled ground beef or turkey, or pork, in addition to the probiotics, digestive enzymes and 1/4 teaspoon of pumpkin. A biscuit at 9ish, another biscuit at bedtime. Occasionally, a bone around 7ish and some fruit or veggies in the afternoon. I think with IBD, it is important to have a little food in their tummy at all time in order to prevent the build up of bile.

                      If you don't want to go the SeaCure route, you could give L-glutamine which you can get in Health Food Stores. This helps heal the lining of the digestive tract and damaged intestinal lining.

                      I also read that you give probiotics and digestive enzymes which is great. A 3rd suggestion would be to consider Bertes Digestion Blend which contains probiotics, digestive enzymes as well as l-glutamine all in one.

                      I would agree with others in saying that the priority is to be concerned with the IBD first, feed accordingly and inject (up to 4 times if required) to treat the diabetes. IBD sufferers definitely cannot tolerate large meals

                      Sorry for being so wordy and long.

                      Good luck with your baby

                      Louise

                      PS: Joan, I'll send you an email to let you know what is happening
                      Hi Louise,

                      It's a pleasure to meet you and thank you so much for this post. For weeks I was feeling like a real oddball with our sweet Katie as we didn't quite fit into other diabetes groups, the Westie health group, nor the IBD group so it gives me hope to hear from others who have managed to find some balance with these issues. Several in the IBD group have mentioned Tylan. A couple of them have been on it for a few years which surprised me. I'm not sure about that for long term. Katie has 15 days worth of Tylan and I'm supposed to call in for further instructions when finished with it. Several in my Westie health group use Sea Cure and swear by it. I have some questions for the Integrative vet when he calls this week with her test results and will ask about Sea Cure.

                      The pre and probiotic combination I got from the integrative vet is called 2Docs GI Defense and it contains L-glutamine as well as other good things like slippery elm. He told me to start out slow or she might get diarrhea so started with a pinch, increasing slightly every 2 days eventually to a scoop which came with the container. The Ranitidine is supposed to help with motility which it does seem to be doing. She's been on that a few weeks now. Being back on 4 small meals, soaking her dry food till soft, giving a treat at bedtime seems to be agreeing well with her. I also like to use pumpkin with her like you do. The vet recommended organic psyllium husk which I picked up but haven't given yet.

                      I'm interested to see if the vet has anything to tell me about her food panel that was run. She's been on different foods over the years but has been on Hills ZD the longest. The new vet doesn't care for it. Changing food is always scary with Katie. We have never tried venison or bison with her. Have tried fish, rabbit, lamb, chicken. We also have to watch her atopic dermatitis and yeast problems as far as food sensitivities. All that said, she is a beautiful, healthy looking little Westie if I say so myself and thankfully I'm retired and with her most of the day so very hands-on with her.

                      I've been testing her BG before each meal and before each insulin injection. Her numbers the last 4 days since her tummy troubles settled down are lowest 135, highest 313 last night but mostly is in the 200's. I'm adjusting 2 doses just a wee bit accordingly. She is now happily running to me for her tests (knowing she gets some celery afterwards for a treat), barking at us to feed her at every meal (takes a while adding her supplements etc. and she HATES to wait), and she's playing with her toys, plus sleeping comfortably through the night. Her entire demeanor has improved. I'm loving this for now, know it's a day by day thing.

                      Thank you Joan for contacting Louis and thank YOU Louise for sharing your experience. The world would be a better place if people treated one another as we on these pet groups treat one another lending support with our babies.

                      Linda
                      Katie/11yr old spayed Westie 19.4 lbs/primary issue of GI sensitivities, food and skin allergies/ diagnosed diabetic 10-19-15/ 2U Novolin BID/

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

                        Hi Linda

                        You seem to have things more under control and I am so happy to read that your girl is improving. It sure looks like you and your vet are on the right track as far as the 2Docs GI defense as it contains the ingredients that help heal the digestive track. The fact that you are able to test is an absolute bonus. If you do a few curves, feed your girl with food that makes her feel good and adjust the insulin, you will soon see a pattern develop.

                        I am also on Westies Health from ear to tails and whenever I see a post about a diabetic westie, I never fail to recommend K9 diabetes. The good people on this site are supportive, helpful, knowledgeable and willingly share their experience.have tons of experience. The good people on this site kept me sane and prevented me from "running to the hills" while I was caring for my diabetic Westie.

                        I also never fail to mention the success that I had with SeaCure on Westie health.

                        As for the food, because Angus' previous owner did not give us any information, no vet records and only mentioned that he ate contaminated food 6 months prior to surrendering him and that he got diarrhea and vomited when under stress, I had to start from scratch.

                        I tried a few prescription diets, hydrolized diets, limited ingredients, home cooking and nothing worked. Then I went to Natural Balance as I was certain that it was a "novel" protein (e.g. one he had never been exposed to). It is also the reason that I switch regularly from Bison to Venison, take 10 days to transition him. I also learned that dogs develop an intolerance to food, which is not necessarily an allergy to the food and the reason that I also vary the cooked meat that I add to it. It is also grain free which is key for Westies. It took me 14 months to stabilize him, then 6 months later he was diagnosed with Addison's.

                        Your girl is lucky to have you as her caregiver. Take good care

                        Louise

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

                          Originally posted by buddingartist View Post
                          Hi Linda

                          You seem to have things more under control and I am so happy to read that your girl is improving. It sure looks like you and your vet are on the right track as far as the 2Docs GI defense as it contains the ingredients that help heal the digestive track. The fact that you are able to test is an absolute bonus. If you do a few curves, feed your girl with food that makes her feel good and adjust the insulin, you will soon see a pattern develop.

                          I am also on Westies Health from ear to tails and whenever I see a post about a diabetic westie, I never fail to recommend K9 diabetes. The good people on this site are supportive, helpful, knowledgeable and willingly share their experience.have tons of experience. The good people on this site kept me sane and prevented me from "running to the hills" while I was caring for my diabetic Westie.

                          I also never fail to mention the success that I had with SeaCure on Westie health.

                          As for the food, because Angus' previous owner did not give us any information, no vet records and only mentioned that he ate contaminated food 6 months prior to surrendering him and that he got diarrhea and vomited when under stress, I had to start from scratch.

                          I tried a few prescription diets, hydrolized diets, limited ingredients, home cooking and nothing worked. Then I went to Natural Balance as I was certain that it was a "novel" protein (e.g. one he had never been exposed to). It is also the reason that I switch regularly from Bison to Venison, take 10 days to transition him. I also learned that dogs develop an intolerance to food, which is not necessarily an allergy to the food and the reason that I also vary the cooked meat that I add to it. It is also grain free which is key for Westies. It took me 14 months to stabilize him, then 6 months later he was diagnosed with Addison's.

                          Your girl is lucky to have you as her caregiver. Take good care

                          Louise
                          Louise, I'm also on the same Westie site so have no doubt received the SeaCure advice from one of your posts. Are you in Ontario, Canada? I was born in London and my heart remains in Canada though I've lived in AZ many years I have a call in to the integrative vet this morning. We were doing so well for 3-4 days. Yesterday about 4am Katie was air licking. I heard her doing this a while, then she went back to sleep and ate normally at 8am, had a great day. This morning again air licking around 5:30am woke me up. Won't eat so no insulin given. I managed to get her Ranitidine down but since she won't eat anything I can't give the Tylan which I hide in her canned food. Her bg readings are really good despite it all. She does not have diarrhea, hardly ever does. It's as though she has reflux. Have you ever heard of a dog having their gallbladder removed? I'm just pulling at straws here and wondered about that. We've been at this a long, long time with her. I have a list of questions when I hear from the vet today, SeaCure is on there.
                          Katie/11yr old spayed Westie 19.4 lbs/primary issue of GI sensitivities, food and skin allergies/ diagnosed diabetic 10-19-15/ 2U Novolin BID/

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

                            Hi there,

                            Yes, I am in Ontario, more particularly living in Bruce Peninsula.

                            Maybe the episodes are getting further apart and you are seeing that the L-glutamine is starting to have some positive effects.

                            Can't say I ever heard of gall bladder removal for a dog.... doesn't mean it never happened.

                            Here is another article that I thought you might find interesting. A study of famotidine (pepcid ac) vs omeprazole (prilosec), the latter seemingly more effective at removing/eliminating bile.

                            http://veterinarymedicine.dvm360.com...?rel=canonical

                            Have a great day and Merry Christmas.

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                            • #59
                              Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

                              I'm concerned about recent higher readings we're getting with Katie. We have to feed her 4 smaller meals due to GI problems. Jesse Girl and Joan as well as buddingartist have posted to me along the way here. (Thank you!) Updating now, we have managed to get 7 good days with no refusal to eat in the morning. She sometimes still does the air licking but no rumbling tummy sounds for a week and has been in good spirits and is having up to 4 normal bms a day now. It used to be 1 or 2. I attribute that to Ranitidine (which helps GI inflammation and motility) plus the GI Defense her new Integrative Vet has us on. She's also on Tylan now for the past 10 days and has 5 more days to go. We don't really KNOW she needed Tylan but are giving it. Her fecal panel showed no infections though she got a false positive c-dif. Internal med vet said it is not a concern, is a false report based on info on second half of the report. Basicially I've opted to go along with the Integrative Vet for a while to see if we can get her GI stuff back to better management as it's her primary disease. Since 12/1/15 her Bgs had been high 100's, 200's to around 346 a time or two and a couple lower numbers 90 or so. On 12/14 she had a 421 just before her last meal of the day meal and second insulin injection of the day. On 12/16 she was 425 at that same time. Then she went along high 100's- higher 200's til 12/24 where her days started to go higher, 228 at morning fasting, 353 at noon, 467 at 4pm, 409 at last fasting of the day. On 12/25 numbers were good till 4pm she was 434 and at last fasting she was 385. On 12/26 her highest was 385, better numbers rest of the day. Was kind of the same 12/27. Then yesterday she was getting 405, 468 mid day to 8PM. First thing this morning at fasting she was 326 which is not at all normal with her. After that 364 at noon (I retested opposite ear and she was 409 within 3 minutes), and at 4pm today she reached an all time high of 495. I gave her 2.5U this morning and a bit less than 2U last night, 1.5U the night before since that injection covers less food with her schedule. Since there have been some changes in her supplements and this Tylan added in in the past couple weeks I was waiting to do full curve till perhaps Thursday or Saturday. She HAD been on 2U am and 2U pm for quite a while. I opened a new Novolin vial on 12/26 to see if that was affecting numbers. I would really appreciate your thoughts. Still waiting on her food allergy panel, should be this week but possibly changing her food is a whole other excitement with gastro issues.
                              Katie/11yr old spayed Westie 19.4 lbs/primary issue of GI sensitivities, food and skin allergies/ diagnosed diabetic 10-19-15/ 2U Novolin BID/

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                              • #60
                                Re: Newly diagnosed need help with other health complications

                                Every small thing has the ability to change numbers. It seems every bit of food, meds, supplements, etc can change blood sugar. You could just now be seeing the full effect of adding in the supplements. Another factor is that her digestion is doing much better and may have caused her numbers to rise. She is digesting at a different rate now which may cause her to use the insulin up faster.

                                One thing that I have found with diabetes is that so many factors change their needs. If you have more than one condition, it just makes it more complicated.
                                Maggie - 15 1/2 y/o JRT diagnosed 9/2007, Angel status on 6/20/16. Her mantra was never give up but her body couldn't keep up with her spirit. Someday, baby.......

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