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Obi: can insulin cause allergic reactions? Not hypoglycemia, but an immune response?
Hi!
This is my first post, but I have been following the forum for a while, and I would like to do a proper introduction with Obi's back story, so I will try to summarize, but also I have a question i'm hoping someone might have insight on.
If a brief back story would help:
Obi is a 9 year old male, neutered lhasa apso. He was diagnosed with diabetes mellitus in December 2015. He was diagnosed with Cushing's around November 2014, and at his November 2015 check up and bloodwork, the Dr determined the Cushings was no longer being controlled by his medicine (trilostane/vetoryl), and he was switched to another (Lysodren).
A few days after starting to take Lysodren he got sick and thinking it was a reaction to his new medicine, we took him to the vet, only to find out he was 1) diabetic, 2) in ketoacidosis with BG in the 600's
He was hospitalized for a few days, and started to bound back, but still isn't 100% back to normal (and I realize he may never be.)
Since the ketoacidosis crisis, we have not been able to get his diabetes managed even though we stick to a strict every 12 hours feeding/injection schedule. The DR put his Cushings treatment on hold, opting to focus on the diabetes. He has gone in for several glucose curves and the Dr is confounded- Obi's blood glucose is all over the place, but mostly stays high.
It seems to stay between the high 300's to 500, especially higher in the mornings, sometimes dropping in to the 200's halfway through the day but we can't figure out a pattern.
He was originally on 5 units of Vetsulin twice a day, but after each subsequent curve he's gone in for, the BG has been trending even higher, so his dosage keeps getting increased until we were up to 12 units of vetsulin twice a day.
After his last glucose curve on Feb. 4, the Dr recommended trying a different insulin.
ANYWAY. long story short, and i'm sorry hit took so long to get to the point:
- On Friday (feb. 5) we started him on 12 units of Novolin twice a day. We also put him back on Vetoryl for his Cushings on Sunday. (The Dr is stumped about Obi's condition, but he thinks maybe the Vetoryl was actually working, but the undiagnosed diabetes could have made his bloodwork confusing.)
- Ever since Sunday, Obi has been kind of weird. He is still eating, drinking, and will get up to outside to the bathroom, but has been shivering a lot, and having short episodes of heavy panting and rapid heart rate, and his back legs have been wobbly, as though he is feeling weak so he spends most of the day in bed.
- Last night i was starting to worry that maybe he was going hypo, so we only have him 6 units after dinner.
- Yesterday we noticed he had a weird, long lump on his chest, starting in his "arm pit" covering most of his rib cage. We pick him up several times a day to carry him upstairs, and the lump definitely wasn't there before.
- When he is lying down, you can poke the lump, squeeze it, and he doesn't seem to mind, but if you try to pick him and put pressure on that spot, it hurts him.
- I thought it was a fatty tumor (even though it just showed up out of nowhere) but a few hours later, it seemed smaller, and smaller. It felt more like a sack of fluid under his skin, rather than a firm lump, but mysteriously it had diminished.
- This morning, before giving him insulin but right after feeding, i took him to the vet for a quick glucose reading - he was at 594! Ok, so definitely not hypo. I took him home and gave him his 12 units of novolin.
It's now about 6 hours later, and he is behaving the same as the last few days.
Then I noticed, the lump is back, only now with another smaller one right next to it!
So i've been googling every combination of "dogs disappearing lumps" and found nothing, then it occurred to me, could it be a reaction?
This is the only clue I found so far, and it is in regards to allergic reactions to "human" insulin in people:
"the main reaction shows as local tender subcutaneous [under the skin] nodules which develop 30minutes to 6 hours after an insulin injection. Inflammation of the lymph glands, a serum sickness reaction and arthralagia have also been reported. Arthralgia is generalised joint and muscle pains."
i found this on http://iddt.org/about/gm-vs-animal-i...ons-to-insulin
Now, i know that website is describing a reaction in people, but it sounds a lot like
I'm waiting for a call from my vet, but he is tied up today and to be honest, he is great, but so confused by Obi's diabetes and Cushings that I don't expect him to have an answer.
While I wait for a call, I went ahead and gave Obi a benadryl which I have successfully given him before as he is prone to skin allergies. Its been about an hour since the benadryl and the "lumps" are still there, but feel smaller- almost like half deflated balloons.
so, what gives? am I losing my mind? has anyone experienced of heard of a dog having an allergic reaction to the insulin, or could it be something completely unrelated? Poor obi has been through so much lately, including a bladder infection 2 weeks ago. I would hate for this to be true, but at this point I almost wouldn't be surprised if some other terrible illness were to blame.
Anyway, I appreciate any insight or theories.
This is my first post, but I have been following the forum for a while, and I would like to do a proper introduction with Obi's back story, so I will try to summarize, but also I have a question i'm hoping someone might have insight on.
If a brief back story would help:
Obi is a 9 year old male, neutered lhasa apso. He was diagnosed with diabetes mellitus in December 2015. He was diagnosed with Cushing's around November 2014, and at his November 2015 check up and bloodwork, the Dr determined the Cushings was no longer being controlled by his medicine (trilostane/vetoryl), and he was switched to another (Lysodren).
A few days after starting to take Lysodren he got sick and thinking it was a reaction to his new medicine, we took him to the vet, only to find out he was 1) diabetic, 2) in ketoacidosis with BG in the 600's
He was hospitalized for a few days, and started to bound back, but still isn't 100% back to normal (and I realize he may never be.)
Since the ketoacidosis crisis, we have not been able to get his diabetes managed even though we stick to a strict every 12 hours feeding/injection schedule. The DR put his Cushings treatment on hold, opting to focus on the diabetes. He has gone in for several glucose curves and the Dr is confounded- Obi's blood glucose is all over the place, but mostly stays high.
It seems to stay between the high 300's to 500, especially higher in the mornings, sometimes dropping in to the 200's halfway through the day but we can't figure out a pattern.
He was originally on 5 units of Vetsulin twice a day, but after each subsequent curve he's gone in for, the BG has been trending even higher, so his dosage keeps getting increased until we were up to 12 units of vetsulin twice a day.
After his last glucose curve on Feb. 4, the Dr recommended trying a different insulin.
ANYWAY. long story short, and i'm sorry hit took so long to get to the point:
- On Friday (feb. 5) we started him on 12 units of Novolin twice a day. We also put him back on Vetoryl for his Cushings on Sunday. (The Dr is stumped about Obi's condition, but he thinks maybe the Vetoryl was actually working, but the undiagnosed diabetes could have made his bloodwork confusing.)
- Ever since Sunday, Obi has been kind of weird. He is still eating, drinking, and will get up to outside to the bathroom, but has been shivering a lot, and having short episodes of heavy panting and rapid heart rate, and his back legs have been wobbly, as though he is feeling weak so he spends most of the day in bed.
- Last night i was starting to worry that maybe he was going hypo, so we only have him 6 units after dinner.
- Yesterday we noticed he had a weird, long lump on his chest, starting in his "arm pit" covering most of his rib cage. We pick him up several times a day to carry him upstairs, and the lump definitely wasn't there before.
- When he is lying down, you can poke the lump, squeeze it, and he doesn't seem to mind, but if you try to pick him and put pressure on that spot, it hurts him.
- I thought it was a fatty tumor (even though it just showed up out of nowhere) but a few hours later, it seemed smaller, and smaller. It felt more like a sack of fluid under his skin, rather than a firm lump, but mysteriously it had diminished.
- This morning, before giving him insulin but right after feeding, i took him to the vet for a quick glucose reading - he was at 594! Ok, so definitely not hypo. I took him home and gave him his 12 units of novolin.
It's now about 6 hours later, and he is behaving the same as the last few days.
Then I noticed, the lump is back, only now with another smaller one right next to it!
So i've been googling every combination of "dogs disappearing lumps" and found nothing, then it occurred to me, could it be a reaction?
This is the only clue I found so far, and it is in regards to allergic reactions to "human" insulin in people:
"the main reaction shows as local tender subcutaneous [under the skin] nodules which develop 30minutes to 6 hours after an insulin injection. Inflammation of the lymph glands, a serum sickness reaction and arthralagia have also been reported. Arthralgia is generalised joint and muscle pains."
i found this on http://iddt.org/about/gm-vs-animal-i...ons-to-insulin
Now, i know that website is describing a reaction in people, but it sounds a lot like
I'm waiting for a call from my vet, but he is tied up today and to be honest, he is great, but so confused by Obi's diabetes and Cushings that I don't expect him to have an answer.
While I wait for a call, I went ahead and gave Obi a benadryl which I have successfully given him before as he is prone to skin allergies. Its been about an hour since the benadryl and the "lumps" are still there, but feel smaller- almost like half deflated balloons.
so, what gives? am I losing my mind? has anyone experienced of heard of a dog having an allergic reaction to the insulin, or could it be something completely unrelated? Poor obi has been through so much lately, including a bladder infection 2 weeks ago. I would hate for this to be true, but at this point I almost wouldn't be surprised if some other terrible illness were to blame.
Anyway, I appreciate any insight or theories.
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