Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

[labblab]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

Good morning! It’s me back again with a quick Cushing’s comment. I just went back and re-read your initial post on K9C, and somehow I had originally missed the fact that even though the LDDS protocol was performed on Bear, the blood samples were not processed by the lab and therefore you truly have no diagnosis at this point. I’m so sorry I missed this earlier, and please correct me if I’m wrong.

But if that’s the case and if the trilostane arrives this week, if Bear were my own, there’s *no* way I would immediately begin treatment under these circumstances and with no actual knowledge about the status of her adrenal function. You are starting to make genuine progress with the insulin — congrats to you and the folks here at K9D! I would be placing my total focus on the diabetes right now. IMO, concern about Cushing’s can and should wait until you’ve had a decent chance to see whether you can gain control with the insulin. I’m not wanting to force you into a battle with your vet, and who knows, Bear may indeed have Cushing’s. So retesting may end up being part of the gameplan. But I’d tell the vet I wouldn’t start such a serious treatment without test verification, and I wouldn’t retest until I’ve first tried to stabilize the glucose level with insulin alone.

Keep up the good work you’re doing now!

[Zoology1603]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

Good morning! It’s me back again with a quick Cushing’s comment. I just went back and re-read your initial post on K9C, and somehow I had originally missed the fact that even though the LDDS protocol was performed on Bear, the blood samples were not processed by the lab and therefore you truly have no diagnosis at this point. I’m so sorry I missed this earlier, and please correct me if I’m wrong.

I haven't got to talk to the doctor who did the blood work yet about this. I just have bits and pieces of information trickled down. At first I heard the lab couldn't do the processing but then later they said it was a positive result. I saw a different doctor during my last visit, the one who is usually out on farm calls. This is when I got the insulin. Without the results in my hand I don't know for sure. I'm obviously not going to pay for any medication without having something in my hands.

[Zoology1603]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

Another assumption to be careful is blaming food for all high numbers or insulin fading . Once again the body could be the blame . Must remember your giving your dog a unnatural process with a time lapse system giving insulin compared to natural which is on demand and some constant slow release using sugar in it to balance to produce energy . Its really an amazing system and surprising how well a couple injections a day can do pretty job

I agree. She dropped from 40lbs to 32lbs pretty quickly and was knocking on death's door. Not only is the insulin new to her body but it's recovering as well. She had no food in her belly for several days, so she's just getting back into eating as well. I'm hoping she never goes back into that pit.

[Zoology1603]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

the curve is on in 3 days , no more changes

I'm going to have to do minimum testing until then. Not only because I have farm work to do but because if I keep using strips as I have been they will be gone before 'curve day'. The new ones haven't been shipped yet and will take all week to get here.

I mixed up half a can of a/d (78 grams) with 50 grams of dry. That was her breakfast. It will be exactly the same tonight. No change.

6:08am :: 485
6:19am :: Meal
6:24am :: 9 Units

I was informed this morning the cushings meds are in and I can pick them up any time.

[labblab]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

I was informed this morning the cushings meds are in and I can pick them up any time.

I agree with what you wrote earlier — I definitely wouldn’t pick them up or pay for them yet. You absolutely are entitled to take time to receive, review and consider actual numerical test results. And I encourage you to also find out exactly what medication was ordered (brandname Vetoryl or a compounded trilostane product) and the dosage. Then you can take time to consider the whole big picture before buying these likely expensive meds right now.

[Riliey and Mo]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

yes, we need to get a curve in first before theres any more changes.

i.d like to see evidence of Cushings disease

please post Bear's 6 hour mark results please

i dont think the time is right here. you posted at around 5am, now it says 8am

can you take his sugar test soon please

[Zoology1603]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

The timezone on the forum isn't right even though I have it set correctly. It's an hour behind me. I had auto DST set but I had to set it always on. Now it's fixed.

I'm deciding if I have the time to go to the vet today and see if I can get some more information.

[Riliey and Mo]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

6:08am :: 485
6:19am :: Meal
6:24am :: 9 Units
12:26pm....468

how are her poops today?

[MomtoMax]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

I’ve been reading this thread and I had a few comments/suggestions I wanted to make.

I’ve been blessed with two Cushingoid dogs in my life and I don’t understand how they can tell you numbers without sending the results to the lab for the LDDST. And a follow-up HDDST is usually done after the LDSST to determine if it’s pit or adrenal. I too had a rural vet when my furkids were diagnosed, but this is pretty basic… My vet was only comfortable in using Lysodren (old school), but it sounds like your vet is up-to-date enough to use the newer gold standard drugs, so I don’t understand why you can’t get a lab result?

You’re in good hands with the diabetes folks here, but I just wanted to throw a thought out there: You mention the weight loss, eating of inappropriate things (determination to get to the chicken poop), soft stools and a rumbly belly. These are all clinical signs of EPI and SIBO (Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency and Small Intestinal Bacterial Overgrowth) and virtually all dogs with EPI have SIBO, which needs to be addressed. This can only be verified thru a cTLI blood test done after a 12 hour fast. Yes, I’ve been blessed with an EPI dog as well.
As for food. I’ve experimented with so many! The only food I’ve found that keeps Max’s BGs in check is The Honest Kitchen Base Mix. It is human grade food that is dehydrated. You then add your protein of choice to the mix and it makes a complete meal. Unfortunately, as with so many things, the company is having supplier issues and orders are severely back-ordered. I’m starting to panic a bit now as Max is now in renal failure and I HAVE to use the base mix, so I can control his protein and I’m running low…That said, I believe some of the mixes that do have the various proteins in them are available.
Donna and Max the Corgi with diabetes and renal failure

[Zoology1603]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

12:26pm :: 468


Weight :: 35lbs

[Riliey and Mo]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

6:08am :: 485
6:19am :: Meal
6:24am :: 9 Units
12:26pm....468

leveling out, no sign of a low, but thats why you test. her low time yesterday was around noon. today no low. good job!!!!! happy dance

how are her poops today?

how is she feeling? she hopping on the couch?
no more excessive drinking water and peeing?

[Zoology1603]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

leveling out, no sign of a low, but thats why you test. her low time yesterday was around noon. today no low. good job!!!!! happy dance

Oh, I thought it was bad. How is it possible to get her down into the 200's? What ideally would be her fasting reading tonight?

how are her poops today?

I wish I could say but it was raining and dark this morning when she went out and she wandered off. Don't know if she pooped or not. She had some nice brown ones but her last one that I saw was a little dark.

how is she feeling? she hopping on the couch? no more excessive drinking water and peeing?

She can get on the couch but her drinking and urinating isn't very low. She has a 1 gallon ice cream bucket at night and it's a little over a 1/4th gone. It used to be half or better gone by morning, so it's come down somewhat. She's begging off everyone she sees. She's been excessively licking people's legs. She looks a little more tired today than yesterday. It thundered all night and that could have kept her up.

[Riliey and Mo]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

she gained 3 pounds? thats warrants a change but we have to wait for the curve

its possible for sure. its only been 2 days, so far shes eating and the insulin is starting to work. shes getting healthier

we need to know if the bowel infection is gone, hoping shes not eating poop. her blood sugar will rise during an infection. once the bowels are

good the blood sugar will drop.

she wandered off. Don't know if she pooped or not. it would be nice to put a camera on her backside

her fasting number tonight hopefully is similar to this mornings depending on whats she eaten today etc. it could also drop significantly.

testings fun!

[Zoology1603]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

testings fun!

lol it would be more fun if someone else was fitting the bill.

she gained 3 pounds? thats warrants a change but we have to wait for the curve

Her normal weight is 38 - 40lbs so I'd like to see her back up there somewhere and put some meat on her ribs. She used to be all muscle, no fat. She lost weight and muscle mass during her sickly time.

she wandered off. Don't know if she pooped or not. it would be nice to put a camera on her backside

Country dog. She's used to her privacy while going to the bathroom. She doesn't like going in the yard. So this is back to her normal behavior.

her fasting number tonight hopefully is similar to this mornings depending on whats she eaten today

Hopefully nothing, everyone knows she's not to be fed.

[Zoology1603]

Re: Diabetic Australian Cattle Dog

Going to the vet tomorrow. That's the plan anyway. I'll pick up another a/d can so I have enough to do the curve. We'll have been using the same morning and evening meal routine 3 days in a row then. I'll get a couple of cans of w/d to see how that works. If it works the plan will be to order a case and I'll be mixing that with the dry from now on. No more diet changes hopefully from then on. It'll mainly act as a topping for the dry.


Test strips were shipped out today. I'll be keeping to testing 3 times a day until we do the curve unless she exhibits odd behavior. I'm going to see if the vet will give me an email address that I can send the curve to. Hopefully they welcome the data. I'll be taking the data in I already have tomorrow as well.