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  • Please please help dog with hyperglycemia

    Hi Everyone, please can anyone help me with some advice as I am in despair.
    I have a 7 year old female Lhasa Apso.
    She was in season at the beginning of Dec 2012, the season lasted longer than normal and she was very hormonal and trying to mate with my other female dogs, which she usually does when she is in season but this time was worse than normal.
    She also has a spur in her spine which she aggravates sometimes so is a bit stiff in movement so she is then treated with Metcam. Two weeks prior to Christmas she appeared to have strained her back so i was treating her with the Metcam which usuallly works but this time didnt.
    I took Mindy to the Vets on the 2nd Jan 2013 who injected her with a Steroid to help with any inflamation and was told to visit them again two days later. Within 1 hour she was jumping around like an over active child and in no time was back to being very quite again. Later on during the day she started drinking loads and weeing alot, which after telephoning the Vets was told that this was a side effect of the Steroid injection and not to worry. I returned to the vets 2 days later who then prescribed me Prednidale tablets which i had to give one once a day. I gave her one tablet of which she seemed to have a reaction to so i took her back to the vets the following day. I asked them to take blood tests which came back as everything normal except for her having high sugar levels. They advised to come back in 3 days and they would check the levels again. Her blood sugar readings were 26.5 at this time and 2 days later I asked for a home visit in case stress was raising her levels but the reading was now 28, this was when the vet told me that my dog had Diabetes.
    Two days later they did a Glucose curve using 3 units of insulin they had no response so sent her home for the weekend to go back in on the Monday 21st Jan to try again.
    On Friday 18th Jan the vet took a blood sample to check for Cushings Disease, this test came back as negative.
    On the Monday they tried her with 5 units of Insulin which they say they saw a curve with. So I was sent home to inject her twice a day with 5 units. 2 days later 23rd back to the vets her reading was now 30. We increased to 7 units for 2 days, back to the vets 25th Jan her reading was now 33, we increased to 9 units for 3 days, back to the vets 28th Jan with her reading now being 36 and now have increased today to 11 units.
    My concerns are why are her sugar levels still rising?
    Her Urine shows Ketones (mid range) which my vet has said is normal?
    Can it be anything else other than Diabetes as my dog prior to the injection had no signs what so ever?
    I have read that Hyperglycemia is very similar to Diabetes?
    Does Hyperglycemia respond to Insulin?
    Any ones help will be greatly appreciated.
    Would you get a Glucose curve in a dog even if the dog does not have Diabetes?
    Thank you for taking the time to read.

  • #2
    Re: Please please help dog with hyperglycemia

    Hi Mindy: I'm sorry things are so scary right now. Steroids have been known to kick dogs into diabetes. And unspayed dogs are really really hard to regulate.

    I'm no expert but I think you need a second opinion RIGHT AWAY. Ketones in the urine are not normal and can be life threatening.

    To me, that is the most important thing for you to focus on right now. I think your dog should be at a vet, getting insulin to bring her sugar down and fluids to flush out the ketones. I'm going to post a link about unspayed dogs and diabetes. Please call a different vet or an emergency vet, ok? Judi

    what Natalie says in this link might be why your vet is not wanting to call it diabetes, but if she were my dog and I got her past this ketone thing, I'd spay her

    http://k9diabetes.com/forum/showthre...6911#post96911

    hopefully some of the more experienced folks will be on soon. I haven't personally dealt with your issues. hugs, Judi
    Jenny: 6/6/2000 - 11/10/2014 She lived with diabetes and cushings for 3 1/2 years. She was one of a kind and we miss her.

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    • #3
      Re: Please please help dog with hyperglycemia

      Hi Mindy

      I don't know where you are and although I am not one of the experts on this board, I can tell you that ketones are not normal and cannot be ignored, if too elevated, they can kill your baby and the condition requires immediate attention.

      If you have access to emergency care, I would suggest that you take your dog there immediately. With such high bg numbers, I would not be surprised if the ketones were even more elevated.

      You can get Ketostix at the pharmacy or Walmart and immediately monitor for ketones

      My second advice would be to get another vet IMMEDIATELY as his/her handling of your baby's case is in my humble opinion completely wrong.

      Meanwhile, if you read this post give us more information about your dog.
      e.g. how much does she weigh,
      has she been spayed yet,
      what does she eat,
      is she on any other medication for any other medical condition
      what insulin is she getting now

      You have come to the right place to get advice and support. Soon, people will start chiming in on how to best handle the situation

      Good luck
      Louise
      Last edited by buddingartist; 01-28-2013, 08:19 AM.

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      • #4
        Re: Please please help dog with hyperglycemia

        I am glad you found your way here as it doesn't sound as though you vet has a great handle on things. Did they mention spaying her? I don't have a lot of time, sick boy and death in the family so I will do some bullet statements.

        - basically hyperglycemia is is high blood sugar which if it continues is diabetes.
        - with an unspayed female insulin needs can vary dramatically, needing a lot one day and not the next, due to the fluctuating hormones. Once dogs are spayed they often become easier to regulate and sometimes recover from diabetes.
        -when numbers keep rising even when increases are done it may be an indication to too much insulin.
        -usually when increases are done there is a settle in period when the body adjusts and the dose reaches it's full effect. It could be that you are moving too fast with the increases creating a rebound effect or that being unspayed is creating a high need of insulin.
        -either way I wouldn't want to be approaching this without home testing Please let us know if you would like info on this.
        - When you refer to curves at the vet, are they testing her every two hours? If you could get those numbers and post it would be helpful.
        -as I see it there was no reason to test for cushings this early. What she needs is to be spayed as soon as she is healthy enough to undergo surgery.
        -yes, I would very much want curves (readings every two hrs. starting just before food and insulin and continuing till the evening meal and injection) to evaluate what is going on. You are in a precarious place with her shifting needs due to being unspayed and the rapid increases.
        - a lot of this info is what I have absorbed from reading here but have no direct experience with. Folks will be along soon who can give additional guidance.

        Tara
        Tara in honor of Ruby.
        She was a courageous Boston Terrier who marched right on through diabetes, megaesophagus, and EPI until 14.
        Lucky for both of us we found each other. I'd do it all again girly.

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        • #5
          Re: Please please help dog with hyperglycemia

          Hi Tara, thank you so much for taking the time to reply. I am in despair. Do i understand that there should be no Ketones in her urine? Thanks Carmen

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          • #6
            Re: Please please help dog with hyperglycemia

            Originally posted by mindy View Post
            Hi Tara, thank you so much for taking the time to reply. I am in despair. Do i understand that there should be no Ketones in her urine? Thanks Carmen
            I think anything over trace is cause for a vet visit. Ketones can progress rapidly and can even be fatal.

            But take a deep breath....

            Again, no direct experience with this, but I would assume it wouldn't be unheard of for a newly diagnosed dog to be shedding trace ketones and the severity of the dog's reaction to the situation depends on some other variables. Here is a link that will explain it.

            http://diabetesindogs.wikia.com/wiki/Ketones

            You can push fluids to help flush ketones out by offering water with added tuna water (juice from tuna packed in water not oil).

            If you see something over trace please call the vet.

            Tara
            Tara in honor of Ruby.
            She was a courageous Boston Terrier who marched right on through diabetes, megaesophagus, and EPI until 14.
            Lucky for both of us we found each other. I'd do it all again girly.

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            • #7
              Re: Please please help dog with hyperglycemia

              i am going to jump on with tara when i saw jesse numbers become more erratic after a dose increase my first thought is i am going in the wrong direction in an overdose event the body tries to protect itself with stored glucose

              now my jesse became diabetic after a heat cycle and had a uterus infection also which she had surgery and that was it for that so you do need to get spayed as soon as you can

              how much does your dog weigh this usually determines a starting dose which is still an educated guess it is very possible you started out with to much insulin and just kept raising the dose because of the higher levels from the overdose yes this does happen my jesse was started at 14 units for the day she ended up at 7 tough working backwards

              your best bet is to test blood sugar at home and find out whats going on just going to the vet for a spot test will not give the info you need to figure this out

              you can get this done but allot of it is up to you welcome and just ask for assistance no problem with long posts
              Jesse-26 lbs - 16.5 years old ,11 years diabetic, one meal a day homemade and a vitabone snack . 3 shots of Novolin( under the Relion name ) a day . Total insulin for a 24 hour period is 6.5 units of NPH insulin .
              Jesse earned her wings on 6/21/2021

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              • #8
                Re: Please please help dog with hyperglycemia

                Welcome. Just have a few minutes, and I'm a slow typist, so this will be a short note.

                Sounds like your vet is taking only a single blood reading and not a curve as Tara suggested. The problem with a single blood test is that the blood glucose can vary widely throughout the day in an uncontrolled pup. A 10 mmol (180 mg/dl for those in the U.S.) range wouldn't be unusual for a uncontrolled pup.

                How much does she weigh?

                Just thinking "out loud", I'm thinking she may be getting too much insulin. A general starting dosage is 0.2 units per pound (I'll let you convert to Kg), and then adjust SLOWLY from there. As an example, and every dog / situation is different, Annie weighs 18 pounds is now getting about 8 units of Novolin-N insulin. I think Caninsulin (if that's the insulin you are using) starting dosage would be about the same (0.2 units per pound).

                Two other things I'd like you to verify:
                What insulin are you using?
                If using Caninsulin, what type syringe are you using. Specifically, are they marked U-40 or U-100?

                Craig
                Last edited by CraigM; 01-28-2013, 04:45 PM.
                Annie was an 18 pound Lhasa Apso that crossed the rainbow bridge on 10-5-17. She was nearly 17 years old and diabetic for 9½ years.

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                • #9
                  Re: Please please help dog with hyperglycemia

                  Just wanted to welcome you Carmen and mindy
                  I agree with the others - bring her to the vet high ketones can be fatal - so you need to get that sorted out ASAP and then get her spayed. I know it's scary when they are first diagnosed but you will get through this and she can lead a normal life with your help.

                  This forum is the best place to help you with your diabetic pup. I am sure more of the experienced members will be along to give you advice. Tara Craig jesse girl Louise and Judi have already given you great advice. Hang on in there but I think you should bring her to see the vet.

                  Anne- Marie
                  Anne-Marie and CJ Westie , Born 13 Jan 2004, dx May 2012, Weight 9.5kg, 6 iu Caninsulin Twice daily. Mixture of food - baby formula and mixture of chicken and vegetables . 4-6 feeds a day due to pancreatitis which is under control.

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