We said goodbye to Poppy yesterday

[mags16]

These forums have been a mine of valuable information for me in the last month.

My little dog, Poppy, was diagnosed with diabetes in early March. She is a 10 year old, 14lb terrier. She was generally looking "grey", if that makes sense - slowing down and looking old. If you threw a ball, she would run for it but be quite wheezy. Then she started to drink lots of water and to have a few accidents around the house.

At the vets, her glucose was over 600 and she was put on 3 units caninsulin twice a day.

She was listless, slept a lot but was happy to come out for walks.

After a week, her glucose level, 5 hours after injecting, was down to 270 which was very pleasing. By this point she was beginning to perk up big-time.

The next week, a test at the same time of day (on a meter) was 86 and 2 weeks later, today, her bg was 58.

I know that the last 2 readings sound really low but I think the vet's instant meter reads low. When her bg was 270, the meter was reading 198.

She certainly has shown no signs of hypoglycemia. In fact she's like a new dog - friends say that she appears so much younger. The wheeziness has disappeared, she is energetic, playful and looks fantastic

We changed her food to Hills R/D with a spoon of minced cooked chicken added and since diagnosis, she has lost 1lb, which is really noticeable on her. The vet wants her to lose another pound before changing to w/d.

I hated the new routine at first - and so did Poppy. In the morning, after breakfast, I'd nearly have to chase her around the house to give her her jab. Then I started giving her a reward - just the tiniest morsel of chicken, and generally making less of a drama of it. Lo and behold, this evening she actually came over and presented her back to me to get injected. What this dog will do for food!

So far, I know I have had an easy ride compared to others on this forum so I am not getting complacent. Luckily I work from home and can keep a close eye on her.

I have 1 or 2 questions

1. My sister-in-law had gestational diabetes and has offered me her glucose meter - would a meter designed for humans work on a dog? I wouldn't mind doing curves and having a little more information on how Poppy's levels are during the day.

2. Is it inevitable that they will lose their sight?

3. Caninsulin is the only insulin that was offered to me. Is it not as good as others? Where I live, we have no Wal-marts so I have no choice but to get the insulin from the vet.

Thanks in advance for your input. It's great to know that I'm not going through this alone.

[BestBuddy]

Re: My Little Dog

Hi and welcome to you and Poppy.

Because you were started on Caninsulin I am guessing Australia or UK???? There are many dogs who do well on Caninsulin and mine was one of them so if you are getting the results then stick with it.

Many use human meters and some are better than others but if you test your meter at the same time as the vet and see what the difference is you will be able to decide if it will be ok for you.

As for the sight loss well it is a lucky (or unlucky) dip but if you can keep the BG at good levels then you are doing the right thing.

Jenny

[buddingartist]

Re: My Little Dog

Welcome to you and Poppy.

Soon some of the more experienced mods will be along to welcome you as well and probably ask you a whole lot of questions as well.

Caninsulin is still sold in Canada and Europe. In the US, it was called Vetsulin and it has been withdrawn from the market. Where about do you live?

Caninsulin seems to work well with you baby. It didn't with mine. If you are enquiring about insulin because of cost and you live in Canada, I bought mine at the local pharmacy for $25.38 (tax included) and no script required. On the other hand, Caninsulin sells for around $46. from the Canadian vets.

I am curious as to why your vet would want Poppy to loose 1 pound. Most dogs will loose a significant amount of weight prior to being diagnosed. I guess you caught it in time with your baby.

When you say the vet's glucometer read 198 but her numbers were 270. Where/how did you get the 270?

As for meters, when my Buddy was still with us, I used the One Touch Ultra 2 and you will find that many of use use the human glucometers because you can get some good deals for the strips pricewise from eBay. When you take Poppy for a blood draw, you can take your meter to the vet and compare the results. It is best to calibrate with their lab but even my own vet used the AlphaTrak. There was a bigger difference in the readings when the numbers were high (in the 500's)

On the other hand, the Alpha Trak (dog meter) is expensive to purchase, not to mention the costs of the strips.

By the way, if my Buddy would have gone down to 58 or even 85, I would have been quite worried about hypoglycemia. Just an opinion. Most people like to have numbers from 100-250. Every dog is different and my Buddy didn't do well below 150-180.

Take good care
Louise

[CarolW]

Re: My Little Dog

Indeed; Caninsulin suggests UK, or Australia, or Canada! Mags, would you tell us which country you're in? Could be a different one, too.

I'm very glad Poppy is doing better. I tell ya though; I don't like those low numbers. There's no "wiggle room" in case Poppy's number drop for other reasons than from the insulin.

I gather, though, you're with her pretty well all day (and night) every day (and night); is that right? Still, the low numbers worry me.

Depending on which country you're in, I'd recommend the OneTouch Ultra2 meter (for humans), if you can get it. I used these meters for my Kumbi for years, and found them ultra-reliable and consistent. There's a thread here with a guy in Australia who just got a OneTouch Verio; which is by the same company - Lifescan. Apparently that's working out well for him.

If you can change to an insulin that's like the NPH insulins of North America, those are very nice insulins, and easier to manage than Caninsulin - easier to avoid those low numbers. Caninsulin has two components, one intermediate, and the other, faster; that's what makes it tricky.

NPH insulin only has one component (active insulin), which keeps things simpler.

"My little dog" - what a poignant title! I love it! Welcome to the forum!

Tue, 3 Apr 2012 18:12:39 (PDT)

[JayneN]

Re: My Little Dog

Warm welcome to you and Poppy! what an adorable name

[MaryLea]

Re: My Little Dog

Hello and welcome to the forum.

We used a human meter and supplies for Ruffles. You don't get perfectly accurate readings, but it's much better than no readings at all. I'm thrilled that you plan to begin testing at home!

Ruffles began losing her sight due to old age before she was dx with diabetes. We did not notice a decline in her sight after dx. Getting Poppy to her maintenance insulin dose is one of the best things you can to to help her retain her sight, IMO. You are already working on that.

Will be watching for your updates. Glad you are here.

Mary

[mags16]

Re: My Little Dog

Welcome to you and Poppy.

I am curious as to why your vet would want Poppy to loose 1 pound. Most dogs will loose a significant amount of weight prior to being diagnosed. I guess you caught it in time with your baby.

When you say the vet's glucometer read 198 but her numbers were 270. Where/how did you get the 270?

By the way, if my Buddy would have gone down to 58 or even 85, I would have been quite worried about hypoglycemia. Just an opinion. Most people like to have numbers from 100-250. Every dog is different and my Buddy didn't do well below 150-180.

Take good care
Louise

Poppy is a greedy little dog and while she was not very fat, she was carrying a bit of weight around her belly. I'm partly attributing her increase in energy to the fact that she is not carrying around that extra pound.

The reason I know that the vet's meter wasn't accurate is that a proper test as well as an instant reading was done at that visit.

I might take up my sis-in-law's offer of the meter. The low numbers are worrying me too. I'm not due to go back to the vet for a month.

I am in Ireland and animal insulins and even Poppy's food is prescription only. Thankfully I have insurance that pays for 65% of the treatment.

My feeling about Poppy is that she is having a brilliant life at the moment, especially with her new-found energy. I'm not going to think too far into the future.

I love this forum!

[eyelostit]

Re: My Little Dog

Welcome

I'd rather see Poppy's BG right now at 150-200 being first diagnosed, I know you don't like to see the 200. I'm concerned about the under 150, you never can tell how your pets BG is reading over the course of the day, you may get a 98 and it can jump to say 350 or more when their BG goes to low. When this happens and it goes too low their body releases it own type of glucose, I won't go into the technical terms right now.

I experienced this with my Niki, as time went by she was going up & up this was the result of too much insulin, Niki went into shock and I gave her maple syrup to bring her BG up, You would think the vet should have known that. I went to another vet, the previous vet never mentioned doing curves and kept up-ing the insulin instead of doing a curve which should have been done.

I used a human meter at first and added 30 points to it, after awhile I bought the alphatrak meter, the strips got expensive, I bought the walmart meter and only used the Alphatrak for curves or if I felt Niki was going to low or I had a funny feeling about her. You still have some time for the BG to go down, how often did the vet do the increases in insulin if these were their instructions?

I hope this is helpful, I know it can all be overwhelming at first.

Dolly and Angel Niki and Pip

[jim maceri]

Re: My Little Dog

Welcome to the Forum. Great folks here and oh so willing to help. We'll all be watching your thread and offering support and advice. I too work out of my home and that really can make this much easier to handle.

[SandyL]

Re: My Little Dog

Welcome to you and Poppy!!

It's great that you're considering home testing! Makes things so much easier when you know on a daily basis what their BG is doing! I wouldn't be concerned about numbers in the 200. We've been doing this for over a year and our ranges typically go from 125-250 and my Tiggy is doing great!

No, it's not inevitable that they lose their sight ( unlike what MY vet told me). There's actually no difference in tiggys eyes since she was diagnosed and there are dogs on here that have been diabetic for years , like Pattys Ali, and they still see perfectly fine!

Sandy

[mags16]

Re: My Little Dog

Welcome

I'd rather see Poppy's BG right now at 150-200 being first diagnosed, I know you don't like to see the 200. I'm concerned about the under 150, you never can tell how your pets BG is reading over the course of the day, you may get a 98 and it can jump to say 350 or more when their BG goes to low. When this happens and it goes too low their body releases it own type of glucose, I won't go into the technical terms right now.

I experienced this with my Niki, as time went by she was going up & up this was the result of too much insulin, Niki went into shock and I gave her maple syrup to bring her BG up, You would think the vet should have known that. I went to another vet, the previous vet never mentioned doing curves and kept up-ing the insulin instead of doing a curve which should have been done.

I used a human meter at first and added 30 points to it, after awhile I bought the alphatrak meter, the strips got expensive, I bought the walmart meter and only used the Alphatrak for curves or if I felt Niki was going to low or I had a funny feeling about her. You still have some time for the BG to go down, how often did the vet do the increases in insulin if these were their instructions?

I hope this is helpful, I know it can all be overwhelming at first.

Dolly and Angel Niki and Pip

Straight after diagnosis, the vet started Poppy at 3 units and that is where she has stayed.

Does a human meter read lower than one designed for dogs?

Thank you so much for all your replies. I'm watching Poppy like a hawk - tho it is not easy when she is running around with a soft toy in her mouth!

[MaryLea]

Re: My Little Dog

Poppy is a greedy little dog and while she was not very fat, she was carrying a bit of weight around her belly. I'm partly attributing her increase in energy to the fact that she is not carrying around that extra pound.

The reason I know that the vet's meter wasn't accurate is that a proper test as well as an instant reading was done at that visit.

I might take up my sis-in-law's offer of the meter. The low numbers are worrying me too. I'm not due to go back to the vet for a month.

I am in Ireland and animal insulins and even Poppy's food is prescription only. Thankfully I have insurance that pays for 65% of the treatment.

My feeling about Poppy is that she is having a brilliant life at the moment, especially with her new-found energy. I'm not going to think too far into the future.

I love this forum!

The human meters do seem to give lower results than the "dog" meters, but still give you a good idea of what's going on. I'd be concerned about the low readings, too. You are also watching her behavior, and that is important.

Glad Poppy is feeling better!

Mary

[mags16]

Re: My Little Dog

Just a little update on Poppy. She is still in great form and is not due to go back to the vet for a couple of weeks. However, she is now giving a yelp now when I inject her. She is normally injected in the scruff but maybe she is developing scar tissue. From watching videos on this forum, behind the shoulder blade is a good place to jab, alternating morning and evening. But now that she is supermodel-thin, there is very little flesh available to "tent".

[Patty]

Re: My Little Dog

Good to hear an update on Poppy. The syringes (U40 29 gauge) used with Caninsulin do have larger needles on them than those used with U100 insulins. There are some people that have used the U100 syringes and used a conversion to achieve the correct amount of insulin. That way they could used smaller 31 guage needles. But it's very important to understand these syringes hold different amounts of insulin and a conversion would need to be made.

There's an information thread on this here: http://www.k9diabetes.com/forum/showthread.php?t=959

Something you could discuss with your vet.

[Soaphie & Sydney's Mom]

Re: My Little Dog

she is supermodel-thin

I only wish someone would describe me that way hehehe