Peeing Problems

[Cockapoo Mom]

successfully tested hate the number though!

Thx to Jim n others for testing advice hot towel worked wonders. Here is my question:
Fasting # at vet 292 8am gave food n 9 units 8:30. At 12:30 he was 262 not great but better than last week. Just now 7:40 pm he 552 now we did give a plethora of treats the hour b be fore we tried to test n failed. It seems insulin working overnite to give decent starting number but maybe not last ing ? What do u think going on? So frustrated he had textbook curv 've s the past 3 months?????? Then 2 weeks ago craziness started.
Baxter
11 y/o dx 7/12
Blue wildrrness chikn grill/1/3 cup innova prime grain free

[jesse girl]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

it takes a bit more information to make a determination extra treats can contribute to higher blood sugar

if this spike is a normal pattern then you want to determine when it starts and maybe ends how much the rise is

i noticed with jesse kibbles were slow for her to digest so she would drop early and rise late

when you saw better regulation was it on the same food you are giving now or was it something different

remember infections and medications can cause higher blood sugar until it clears and the need for medication is ended and not much you can do about that unless you wanted to use a fast acting insulin as a temporary bases to correct higher blood sugar

i am not one to raise the basal insulin (nph) because once the infection has cleared you might have quite a bit extra insulin working in the background

its not uncommon to see spikes later some believe its insulin running out i believe there is something else going on because i saw the same thing in jesse which disappeared over time and she got full duration so i believe if it was the insulin it would have remained constant but you can never know for sure

great you figured out how to get good drops of blood it does feel empowering that you can do something to help your pup this is just one step

[CraigM]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

Also guess what / how much a "plethora" is?

A full sized Milkbone type treat late in the cycle, when the insulin might be wearing off, would probably give Annie a 200 point rise. Hard to estimate.

Our treats are usually 1 - 2 pieces of frozen green beans (yes, frozen). If Annie gets any other type of treat, I don't expect good BGs: BGs could be lower if she goes crazy like with a rawhide, or higher if a treat she eats quickly.

Craig

[Cockapoo Mom]

freaking out please help!!

We tested bax at 7:40pm and he was 552 food 8:20 9 units humuln n insulin given 8:40 just tested now 11 pm its
500 what is going on? We r so scared do we have to go to emergency vet it seems insulin
Humulin n 9 units not working anymore...don't know what to do. Need help.

[SandyL]

Re: freaking out please help!!

Don't freak out, he'll be fine.... Might feel a bit crappy all night but none the less he should be ok.

It sounds like all , or as you put it , plethora of treats are really kicking in for Baxter. Like Craig said, treats can affect dogs differently. I can give Tiggy 1/2 of a small milkbone and it can raise her 100+. Points and keep her there for quite some time. Unless you have some R insulin, there's not much you can do but rest assured dogs can handle a high number just fine for short periods of time

Sandy

[CraigM]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

It's hard to follow your timing, but I think you've given a bunch of treats and a meal in the past 3 - 4 hours? That could cause the high readings you are seeing. In some dogs, N can take several hours to bring BG downward. I know its getting late where you live, but maybe check in another 2 - 3 hours.

Just saw that Sandy has given you some good words.

Craig

[Cockapoo Mom]

treats food and insulin

Hi so baxters starting fasting bg was 389 this morning so compared to 550 reading last nite at 11pm am I fair to assume he is responding to the humuln n ?? he ate all meal last nite 8:20 n got 9 unit 8:40pm..if u follow ed my thread baxters dadfdy gave him tons of treats last nitr as we attempted testing n wanted to reward him he was so good..not a good idea we know now!do u think treatfest contributed to higher starting number? Do treats hang around that long? Do u think vet may increase dose back to his original 10 units? She lowered b cuz he had a 57 start value but also had uti. Thoughts?

[SandyL]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

Yep, he's definitely responding to the insulin. There's no doubt that all the treats you gave him caused the higher BG and it could take some time for it to settle down and be in a lower range

When I give Tiggy treats when I'm doing a curve ( she gets something after ever test) I usually go with small pieces of boiled chicken, green beans, or broccoli. None of these raise her BG. When she's running too low is when I give her a normal dog treat. Just to raise her to a higher level to where I feel comfortable

Sandy

[CraigM]

Re: treats food and insulin

if u follow ed my thread baxters dadfdy gave him tons of treats last nitr as we attempted testing n wanted to reward him he was so good..not a good idea we know now!do u think treatfest contributed to higher starting number? Do treats hang around that long? Do u think vet may increase dose back to his original 10 units? She lowered b cuz he had a 57 start value but also had uti. Thoughts?

Just wondering, what were the treats? Regular puppy treats?

Still hard to tell if the food (plus treats) from yesterday caused the 389 this morning or not. Probably did cause some of the higher numbers.

Another thought is that Annie frequently has slightly higher morning fasting numbers because , I think, of the inactivity overnight. (I've been meaning to test this early morning inactivity theory in Annie, but just haven't got around to it)

If you see, or consult with the vet, be sure you mention the treats. You wouldn't want the vet to make dosage changes based on a day with so many treats / variables.

Craig

[Cockapoo Mom]

update baxters mini curve

Hi thx craig n sandy for info. We at least know he is responding to insulin itll b interesting to see duration n if he climbs when that occurs. So if this morning he was 389 n had food insulin 8:40 that might bring him up to say 489 bcuz of food right? So at 12:40 he 318 so he got 100 +point drop can someone chime in what a good curve looks like n what duration of humukin n shoukd be. Also is running high 200s low 300s acceptable? He's acting fine. Maybe vet will up dose back to 10 units after awhile if he still starts in high 200s?? Thoughts? Thx happy dt. Pats day we started it with no hot water n busted hot water heater so not fun!

[Cebe]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

Also guess what / how much a "plethora" is?


Craig

I know what a plethora is, Jefe.


Cockapoo Mom, are you presuming that 489 number or is that from a test?

for my dog, she actually used to have an early drop with humulin. So, if she tested 275 at 6am, in a couple of hours, she might drop to 175. My vet wasn't too worried about 100 pt drops, though they are not ideal. She said she would be worried if it were more than 100 points in a short time.

You know, it's hard to remember what an ideal curve is. I think it's an upside down smile. Lower initial number, with a slight rise and tapering offer by the next fasting.

My dog does the opposite. She starts higher, then goes lower after food and shot, then rises before the next food/shot.

I would feel the need to address my dog's blood sugar if I got consistent readings in the 300s. Consistent reading in the 200s would not cause me to adjust (because my dog drops with exercise, etc.). Does that help you understand what the acceptable ranges are?

Happy St. Pat's to you too. Sorry about your hot water heater. I now have a tankless, and I like it a lot. Best wishes!

[CraigM]

Re: update baxters mini curve

can someone chime in what a good curve looks like n what duration of humukin n shoukd be. Also is running high 200s low 300s acceptable? He's acting fine. Maybe vet will up dose back to 10 units after awhile if he still starts in high 200s?? Thoughts? Thx happy dt. Pats day we started it with no hot water n busted hot water heater so not fun!

There's the rub, there isn't a perfect curve shape! Many textbooks show a "bowl" shape curve where the lowest numbers would be around the 6 hour point. Unfortunately, most dogs haven't read the textbooks! The shape is really different for each situation. Some dogs might drop shortly after the insulin injection and then rise later in the cycle. Others like Annie, would jump 100+ points soon after a meal and injection, stay high for several hours, and then come down to her lowest number at around 10-12 hours after the injection. So the shape varies with lots of reasons: food (ingredients + amount), insulin dosage, insulin absorption (where you inject might make a difference), activity level, and probably a dozen more reasons! Most of us would be very happy if our pups would just stay in a 100-225 range. Even a 100-250ish range makes me happy, and I do get some readings outside that range. The shape of the curve isn't all that important.

Recently, I think I've been able to flatten (remove the big up/down moves) by adding a bit more fiber to Annie's diet. I'm adding a bit of black beans and sugar free Benefiber. I'm not 100% sure this is the reason, but her curve has been flatter the past month with the added fiber. Again, every dog is different!

Craig

[Cockapoo Mom]

update on baxter cataract question

Hi so bax saw eye vet for his one month follow up his cataracts have stayed the same we have been using ocluvet drops 3x day for last month.per eye vet his are immature. his right eye worse than left n the cataracts are not dense. Eye vet not sure if drops or his genetics but my question is does anyone have a pup with cataracts n they r not blind? How long with cataracts? Bax has 80% sight in left n peripheral in right eye. Vet said diabetic cataracts come on suddenky n eyes turn white he still gets reflection etc I guess there are 2 types cataracts senile n diabetic. Any insight pardon the pun. Bax getting gluc curve at vet wedneeday ill update then thx!

[Patty]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

I just got done catching up on your thread and merged a couple more together as well. It's good to keep all of Baxter's info in one place so we can go back and look to see what's been done. If you ever need to find it, you can locate your thread by clicking on "statistics" on your profile page, then "find all threads started by __"

The underlining tone in reading through is a natural one of will Baxter be ok at the range he currently is at, and when should we increase insulin, etc.

First of all, congrats on home testing! That is a huge benefit in regulating your dog.

Second, with the recent treats Baxter has had, etc it can take a while to establish what will be his new pattern. I'm glad you have a curve scheduled. But I would want to "study" Baxter's pattern for awhile. If 10u had been too much previously, it might take a little while for the 9u to settle in...or perhaps he needs something in between, like 9 1/2u.

But now that you can home test, don't panic with the numbers. Just observe. See how his pattern varies. Is there some consistency to it? Does exercise seem to affect him? Note when he's gotten treats by your hubby so you can account for the variation.

Then you can make an educated decision on insulin dosing with your vet and how well the food/insulin/meds he's on, etc are matching up. But I would want at least 5 days of a consistent schedule before making those decisions.

Hope that helps,
Patty

[Cockapoo Mom]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

Thx Patty. I think you are right. We shall see what tomorrows curve brings. Thx Jen