Peeing Problems

[caravandog]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

Hi there. Molly has had exactly the same thing happen to her. One day itwill drop by over 150 next hardly at all. Thus it is safer to keep her a little bit higher than letting her get too low. Antibiotics definately do have an effect on their sugars so it may be that such has caused the shortness of effect. Only repeating the curve over two to three consecutive days will help your vet make a decision as to what is going on.
She also shows very little difference in highs or lows. It is very difficult especially when they are older and sleep alot anyway. I watch her tail to see if it is tucked undr her, her breathing is also an indicator. I always check her sugar if she pants on her walk. The only sure sign of a low in shaking when she stands. Make sure you trust your instincts and test when you think something is up.
No idea about the colesterol, sorry but I'm sure someone will.
Molly has been very difficult to regulate, often over 400, for about three years now but is generally quite happy unless she has an infection. Regular testing is the only way to keep any handle on this and try not to panic and over administer intact I generally give less and then gradually increase it just incase she is getting too much. Make sure you are getting sufficient water into the food yo help the kidneys out.

[4minischnauzers]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

Not sure about doggies havn't experienced that yet Sugar ws only diagnosed 1 mnth ago, but if my late husband was on antibiotics, his insulin did not bring down BG hardly at all, if he had an infection his BG would shoot up too..

[momofdecker]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

Hi, so vet consulting with specialist, because Baxter started at 262 and with food and insulin only went down 27 points then climbed towards 500 by 4:00. I think some of you may be able to shed some light: Please answer any or all of these questions if you can. Thanks...so frustrated.

1. Has anyone been through a pattern where insulin just isn't working as well (he only went down 27 points) with 9 units after breakfast.

Yes, Decker went from December 2011 - May 2012 following a similar pattern. Sometimes he'd have large swings in bg. Sometimes he'd have very little movement and stay elevated and flat. He started at 40u of humulin n (overdosed), dropped to 20u (still too much), dropped to 15u, back to 20u (still too much), dropped to 16u and hit a wall. Went up to 37u and his bg ran 300 - 600 most of the time.

2. did anyone have to change from humulin N to another insulin?

In May 2012 he was switched to levemir insulin, which is four times as potent as humulin n. He went from 37u of humulin to only 5u of levemir (which would be equal to 20u humulin). The levemir showed promise in the beginning but around 6-9u he started to show a similar pattern of regression that he showed on the humulin. He saw 500's at 5u and 500's at 9u. He hit regulation range numbers at 10u. 10u of levemir would equal around 40u of humulin. He was overdosed on 40u humulin but it took the equiv of 40u (via 10u levemir) to hit regulation range numbers. That was June 2012 - and when we pushed to have him tested for concurrent diseases in hopes of figuring out why he'd been so difficult to regulate.

3. what do antibiotics and infection due to insulin absorption? He took last dose antibiotic zeneiquin last nite.

Decker had one UTI and two nasty infections on his belly, near his nipple area. All raised his bg more than normal.

4. Why does he act fine at 57 or 500?

Decker did not give any direct clues when his bg ran low. Testing was the only way we knew. When his bg went from 57 to 500 in a short period of time he'd drink tons, need lots of potty breaks and curl up in the corner and sleep. When his bg ran a consistent 300 - 600 he had decent energy and would run and play. His drinking was above average but not to the point he had accidents in the house.

5. Could being at vet throw levels off, but he has had perfect curve at vet before??

Was a complete blood count (CBC) and/or chem panel done at time of diabetes diagnosis? I firmly believe every newly diagnosed diabetic dog should have a CBC and full chem panel run. That way, should challenges occur down the road you have a baseline health view to refer back to. For example, are the elevated chol and tri values new or have they been present since diagnosis? If the answer is unknown you have no way of knowing if they are contributing to the change in bg readings. If they were present and the curve pattern has changed it may be worth looking at something else. If they were not present and now are, it may be worth looking more closely at what may be causing the elevation and how that elevation may be impacting the bg readings.


6. have any of your dogs had long periods of high sugar, what is the result? or can dogs tolerate higher sugars?

Decker's bg ran mostly 300 - 600 from January 2012 - May 2012. He lost his vision to diabetes induced cataracts in May 2012. His energy started to show signs of declining in March 2012 and nose dived in May 2012. He also had undiagnosed hypothyroidism, which was the cause of his high cholesterol (1055) and high triglycerides (383). He also suffered from pancreatits as a result of the high lipid levels. The hypothyroidism likely contributed to his increased lethargic behavior.

Thank you! Baxter 11 y/o diagn. 7/12. feeding 1/3 cup blue chicken beef grill/1/3 cup innova prime grain free 9 units am and pm.

6. Does high cholesterol have anything to do with insulin absorption?
Yes, both high chol and high tri can hinder insulin absorption.

Typed my responses in blue. Hope you are able to find some answers for Baxter soon. Holli

[Cockapoo Mom]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

Hi thx to all who answered. Yes a cbc n thyroid run only thing was high cholesteril increased slghtly from dx time in july. Ill update when vet calls me tomorrow. We r gonna have to start home testing terrified ; (my husband thinks vet office stressing him cuz he has to b caged n he never is at home. What is easiest meter for newbie?

[amydunn19]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

I like the One Touch Ultra - I have used it for years and buy my strips on eBay. I don't know if one is easier than any other. Testing is not as stressful as it might seem. I use the base of the tail on one of the many bumps my dog has. Some people use lips or ears. I think you will feel so much better about things when you start testing.

[Cockapoo Mom]

Update on Baxter

Hi everyone..Happy Friday! I just talked to my vet (she called me on her day off she is so sweet) , anyway, they are lending us their glucometer over the weekend after prepping us with usage instructions to record Baxter's numbers. If numbers continue to be wacky, she wants us to try switching to
insulin starting with "G"..sorry forgot..it's $250 for 10 month supply. Also, they want to do xrays of abdomen just to rule out anything else. Has anyone used this begins with "G" insulin? she said super potent and he only needs 1.5 units dose with full meal. They are ordering it, and we'll start the new one next week. Still wondering why Humulin N gave him perfect regulation for 8 months and now numbers wacky. Hoping the UTI infection and zeniquin may have been the cause,, although he did get a super low number BEFORE infection...hoping and praying we get those nice steady numbers back! Please chime in if you have anything you can add. Merci! Bon Weekend! (I'm a French Teacher)

[momofdecker]

Re: Update on Baxter

The description sounds like levemir...also known as detemir. Any chance that g was a d? If you can make home testing work that would be impt given the potency of it. Very kind of your vet to loan you their meter.

We used the one touch ultra human meter. Liked reliability and it was close to vet meter. Does require more blood than other meters though. Wishing you good luch with home testing. Lots of great resources on the main site.

Lantus is also known as glargine but I don't know of many dogs that get switched from nph to lantus.

[CraigM]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

Baxter seems to have several active threads, so I've combined the last two threads into one to make it easier to follow his "story"

Craig

[jesse girl]

Re: Update on Baxter

they may have meant glargine insulin which is lantus i have only seen one dog on the forum that did have success with it

we tried it on jesse a freind gave us some but it was a bit old so we dont no where the potency was and we could not compare it to anything because it was the first time we used it

we did not try it for very long if i saw some early positive results we would explore further jesse is on one meal a day so we were hoping that we could just give one shot because it was advertised as a 24 hour insulin

well we did not see that and i did not see anything positive but like i said there may have been other factors at play and we did not give it much of a try

as you said you did see good regulation on nph and as you know many things can upset that regulation and has nothing to do with the insulin if baxter just struggled from day one then yes an alternative would be at the top of the list

it seems like levemir as holli described is the best alternative to nph it is 4 times more potent than nph so you get into a micro dosing situation

i think testing this weekend can give you some insight to what is going on you can post any numbers you get

[Cockapoo Mom]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

Yes it is Detemir insulin. So anyone with experience with this one please chime in..and thanks Craig for merging threads for me

[momofdecker]

Re: Baxter needs your insight

Here are some links for you regarding use of levemir (detemir):

http://petdiabetes.wikia.com/wiki/Levemir

Humulin N:
http://petdiabetes.wikia.com/wiki/Humulin_N

An article on insulin administration:
http://todaysveterinarypractice.epubxp.com/i/43037/65

Jeanne & Al's Mini-Me has recently switched from NPH to levemir and I've been providing links to other levemir users on her thread:
http://k9diabetes.com/forum/showthre...highlight=mini

My personal opinion is that levemir seems to work better in dogs with elevated to high lipids. It did show positive signs of working with Decker early on but then we did start to see 500's mixed with 200's, 300's, 400's even on higher units of levemir. I have no data to back up my thought process - just an observation that difficult to regulate dogs (who often have elevated triglycerides and/or cholesterol values) are switched to levemir in effort to obtain better regulation. I've mentioned it to Jeanne (Mini-Me's mom) that there is little data about use of levemir in canines. Studies have been done as to how it works in felines but nothing that I can find regarding how canines are doing with the insulin. Would be interesting to see some data / case studies of how the insulin works with dogs in general, maybe even with dogs that have elevated lipid values...


If you do make the switch and are comfortable sticking around and sharing your experience it may help others to have one more person/dog's account of how levemir worked for them.

I do want to follow up on one thing Jesse Girl mentioned and that is the need to micro dose. Given it's potency, levemir can be challenging in dogs that do not require a lot of insulin to begin with. 1.5u is not a lot and if you get to the point you need to adjust you could be looking at 1/4u or even 1/8u adjustments with levemir. For some folks that is a deal breaker as the difficulty in repeating a 1/4u or 1/8u shot is not something everyone is willing to take on.

[Cockapoo Mom]

failing home testing with alphatrak 2 please help

Hi vet gave us alphatrak 2 we are not getting enough blood using lancing device on strongest setting we r trying in ear vet even shaved hair. Need suggestions we do not wanna do lip need to make ear work please help. Thx

[jim maceri]

Re: failing home testing with alphatrak 2 please help

Hi and welcome. Have you tried warming the ear with a hot towel? I would first massage and rub the ear to get the blood flowing ( most dogs love the ear scratch anyway). Hold a hot towel on the spot and maybe try to use the lance freehand without the device. I never had any luck with a lancing device and got rid of mine the first week I started testing. How about the base of the tail, carpal pad? Keep at it, home testing is worth the effort.

[Cebe]

Re: failing home testing with alphatrak 2 please help

Also do you know what size the lancet is? I test on the carpal pad (the unused extra pad on the back of the front leg. For that area I need to use larger lancets. So lancet size matters and can really make the difference.

And I agree about hand poking. The lancet device is a hassle and never worked well for me.

Keep at it. You will figure it out. And tell us more about your dog when you have a moment!

[CraigM]

Re: failing home testing with alphatrak 2 please help

Jim's ideas are all good. I cup my hand around Annie's ear for 30 - 40 seconds while massaging. I then rub a very small (pin point) amount of Vaseline over the area. The Vaseline helps the blood to form a "ball" and not flow into the surrounding hair.

Then poke, either with or without the devise. I usually have to squeeze around the test spot to get the"ball" to form.

I know this is too early, but this usually gets much easier in warm sunny weather. Annie enjoys to sun bath, and if I test her ear after she had been out sunning for a few minutes, the blood flows like a river (actually scared me the first few times, there was so much blood!)

Craig